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The Fastest Scandal Ever

[ Posted Thursday, September 26th, 2019 – 17:00 UTC ]

We all know how much President Donald Trump loves superlatives, most especially when they are used in reference to himself or his presidency. This week added yet another one of these superlatives, since Trump is now at the center of the fastest-progressing political scandal ever. Think about it: a mere two weeks ago, nobody knew anything about it; and now we've seen the public release of a president-to-president phone call's semi-transcript, the public release of the whistleblower's slightly-redacted complaint, testimony on the scandal before both houses of Congress, and the start of impeachment proceedings. To say the past week has been a whirlwind doesn't even begin to accurately describe the blinding pace of the growing scandal.

Of course, a lot of in-depth research would have to be done to prove the accuracy of the "fastest scandal ever" title, but because things are moving so fast there simply isn't time to do such digging. Perhaps the Teapot Dome scandal moved faster, or perhaps the speed of the unveiling of the XYZ Affair was quicker. But it's doubtful. What can accurately be said is that this is the fastest-moving scandal in living memory -- mine, at any rate. Normally there is a drip-drip-drip of revealed facts that builds over time (usually many months of time), but this one has been an absolute firehose rather than slow drips. As with all things connected to Trump, the narrative changes so fast that taking the time to type an article such as this one leaves me wondering what I'm missing in the meantime -- things that might make what I write obsolete before I even publish it.

At the dawn of the scandal -- in the dim and distant past of two weeks ago -- there was an odd but mostly-obscure fight between Adam Schiff and the Department of Homeland Security over a whistleblower report that hadn't been sent to Congress as the law dictates it must. Nobody had any idea what the fight was even about or what was in the whistleblower's report. It was treated as a minor side story, just another one of those "Trump stonewalls Congress" episodes that are become more frequent as time goes by. Little attention was paid to the whole matter by the media -- at first, that is.

Then things started to slowly leak out. The whistleblower's report was about Trump's communication with the Ukraine. It involved "a promise" Trump had made. Perhaps something about Joe Biden and his son. And the holdup of military aid to the country. The whole thing started out vague, but as different media outlets began to compete for "who has the best scoop," the story began to get more substantial. This all brings us to the middle of last week. Then the dam began to burst, as both Trump and his minion Rudy Giuliani went on the record stating that yes, the whole thing was about the Ukraine, and furthermore, yes, both men had indeed been pressuring the newly-elected leader of the Ukraine to dig up some dirt on the Bidens, pronto. Trump's flock of apologists was then unleashed, to obfuscate and deny everything to the media. The pressure grew to find out exactly what was in the whistleblower's report, and what was said during the most-recent phone call between Trump and the Ukrainian leader. That brings us roughly to last weekend.

This week, the scandal expanded in explosive fashion, when Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi announced that the House would begin an impeachment investigation. Around the same time, the Trump White House announced it would release an unredacted transcript of the call the next day. Later, they also committed to releasing a lightly-redacted copy of the whistleblower's complaint. By this time, the whistleblower was in negotiations (through his or her lawyers) to testify before congressional committees -- which the whistleblower was apparently eager and more than willing to do.

The next day, the semi-transcript was released. It was just as bad as everyone expected, because it clearly shows an American president colluding with a foreign leader to provide dirt on his chief political opponent, the man who is leading the polls to run against him next year. Trump, in true Mafia-boss fashion, only coyly hints at a quid pro quo, but the collusion is plain for all to see even without that aspect of it. Think about it -- even if the withheld military aid didn't exist as an issue, Trump is still personally seeking political dirt from a foreign leader, which fits his own definition of collusion.

Today, the whistleblower's report was released, and it too was just as bad as everyone expected. The people in the White House tasked with the eternal and thankless job of "cleanup on aisle Trump" apparently moved the call's semi-transcript to the most secure government server available -- one that is only supposed to be used to protect the highest-level national security secrets, not secrets that could do political damage to the president. There is also an accusation that this isn't the first time Trump's toadies have done so with potentially-problematic call readouts for purely political purposes.

Also today, the head of national intelligence testified before committees from both houses of Congress (one in open session, and one with the doors closed). He made his case that he tried to do the right thing even though the whole situation was so unprecedented (a word he kept returning to, for good reason).

In other words, it's been hard to keep up with such rapidly-unfolding events. After all, it's only Thursday, so who knows what else this week might bring? The whistleblower may even testify before the week is done, if the rumors are to be believed. In a little over a week's time, the whole thing went from zero to impeachment, complete with documents released and congressional testimony. That is lightspeed for any scandal. In fact, it's lightspeed for just about anything happening in Washington, where the word "glacial" is almost always appropriate to describe the pace of things. At this rate, maybe the entire impeachment episode -- no matter what the outcome -- might just be over by Thanksgiving. Or even Hallowe'en. That's how fast things seem to be moving right now.

Stunningly, there are now calls for Nancy Pelosi to cancel the next routine two-week vacation for House members, which is supposed to begin next week. Already the chair of one of the investigating committees has announced that the committee's work will continue during the break, meaning the members of the committee will be denied yet another multiweek vacation. That may sound a bit snarky, but it is in reality a measure of the severity and speed of what is happening right now. Congress almost never denies itself vacation time, and the threat of eating into such vacations is routinely used (most notably and effectively by former Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid) as a goad to get necessary legislation passed. In other words, you know it is serious when members of Congress stay in D.C. when they were scheduled to be elsewhere.

The outcome of this scandal (which still hasn't been given a "-gate" name, because events have been moving too fast for the pundits to get that bored) is still unknowable. The House could impeach, or they could fail to. The Senate probably won't remove Trump from office, but you never can tell. With the blinding speed of the revelations, any outcome seems equally possible at this point. How it will affect partisan politics and the presidential race is actually a secondary concern, for once, because we simply haven't had the time to ponder such tangential effects.

Whatever happens, though, one thing seems clear. Unlike Robert Mueller's excruciating investigation, this one is moving much faster (and that's an enormous understatement). Whether it takes down a president or not, this has got to be the fastest-moving scandal in American political history. Maybe it'll even slow down enough by the weekend for me to have the time to research the historical accuracy of that label....

-- Chris Weigant

 

Follow Chris on Twitter: @ChrisWeigant

 

139 Comments on “The Fastest Scandal Ever”

  1. [1] 
    Paula wrote:

    It's always been a matter of time - there was going to be a tipping point. Today a couple of polls were at 49-47 pro-impeachment - this shows a leap from a week or two ago. This scandal is resonating.

    Some Mega-Toady Repubs are publicly supporting Blotus with stupid/absurd rationalizations; most of the rest are lying low and refusing to comment. It's amazing how many are claiming to have not read the complaint yet - cowardly dereliction of duty (though no doubt they're actually lying). If this is the level of support Blotus can muster from the GOP he's in trouble.

    Meahwhile Blotus seems intent on taking some of his toadies down with him - which would be lovely. They, otoh, may choose to save themselves - we'll see.

    Dems need to hang this whole thing firmly around the neck of the GOP. As Liz Warren put it, this fight needs to end "with blood and teeth on the floor" so that even if the Senate Repubs refuse to do their constitutional duty and put the country before their rancid party they pay for it in loss of reputation and control of Senate.

  2. [2] 
    dsws wrote:

    In any situation involving tension between Congress and the executive branch, we're sure to encounter the word "coequal" with depressing regularity. I'm not entirely convinced that it even really is a word. But word or not, it certainly doesn't fit the way the Constitution says things are supposed to be. The Constitution includes a list of all the powers of the federal government, and it introduces that list with the words "Congress shall have the power to ... .". That list contains in particular the necessary and proper clause. Some powers (treaties and appointments) are given jointly to the Senate and the president. For the president alone, the document provides one power: to require the opinion in writing of the heads of the executive departments. That's it.

    That is nothing like a "coequal" allocation of powers, let alone the imperial presidency that we have.

    There are reasons for the way we do things. They're just not remotely in sync with what the supposedly supreme law says.

  3. [3] 
    dsws wrote:

    Meanwhile on the scandal du jour, I stand by my previous assessment: this changes nothing. It doesn't matter what the text of any statute is. It doesn't matter what the factual details are. No one who was on Trump's side in the first place will flip-flop because of this.

  4. [4] 
    dsws wrote:

    No one.

  5. [5] 
    Don Harris wrote:

    Let's hope it reaches a conclusion just as quickly.

    Then you might have time to research why Congress was scheduled for two weeks off when they just got back a few weeks ago.

    You might even find the time to inform citizens aboot what they could do aboot why Congress was scheduled for two weeks off because if Congress worked for ordinary citizens instead of the big money interests they would be the kind of legislators that would keep working trying to get things done and also wouldn't have to waste time with investigations into and impeachment proceedings against the big money politicians because those corrupt politicians wouldn't be in office to be investigated and impeached.

    It's almost as if all these scandals are just a distraction to get people excited thinking that it might lead to something that it never does so people don't take the time to take any real action that is needed to end the corruption.

    Maybe you should just do one column a week covering all the scandals so you have time to cover something other than the show.

    Otherwise you are part of the problem- whether you are fooled by the show or willingly playing your part in the evil scheme.

  6. [6] 
    Kick wrote:

    dsws
    2

    For the president alone, the document provides one power: to require the opinion in writing of the heads of the executive departments. That's it.

    That's it!?

    So by "document," you seem to be stating that the Constitution provides "one power" to the president so I have to ask: Have you read the whole "document"?

  7. [7] 
    Kick wrote:

    dsws
    3

    Meanwhile on the scandal du jour, I stand by my previous assessment: this changes nothing.

    This changes public opinion.

    It doesn't matter what the text of any statute is. It doesn't matter what the factual details are. No one who was on Trump's side in the first place will flip-flop because of this.

    Just FYI: I've received phone calls from several of "we the people" who just did. Things change from the bottom up.

  8. [8] 
    Kick wrote:

    Don Harris
    5

    Maybe you should just do one column a week covering all the scandals so you have time to cover something other than the show.

    Maybe you should pound sand or just eff right off.

  9. [9] 
    Balthasar wrote:

    Think way, way back, when Pelosi said that Trump would "self-impeach". Then, of course, came the Trump administration, and each time that there was a scandal (and there were alot of those) Pelosi said, "No, that's not it" often to the consternation of her fellow Democrats.

    Now it seems that she was prescient, when the truth is that she knew that sooner or later Trump would do something so over the top that they'd HAVE to impeach him.

    As Paula noted, public opinion is changing fast, if the first poll on the subject is any indication. Taken Monday, it shows a near tie in public opinion, which is amazing, because the bulk of what Trump did wrong wasn't even KNOWN at the time.

    Because the "smoking gun" was discovered first, it's also a backward-sort-of scandal, wherein we discover first that he did it, and then have to discover just how deep the corruption is.

    Note: the whistleblower hasn't even testified yet. That should be interesting indeed, even second hand.

  10. [10] 
    Michale wrote:

    @Paula

    It's always been a matter of time - there was going to be a tipping point. Today a couple of polls were at 49-47 pro-impeachment - this shows a leap from a week or two ago. This scandal is resonating.

    It's funny...

    That is almost EXACTLY what ya'all said about ya'all's Russia Collusion delusion.. :D

    Uncanny, iddn't it?? :D

  11. [11] 
    Michale wrote:

    @Blathy,

    Think way, way back, when Pelosi said that Trump would "self-impeach". Then, of course, came the Trump administration, and each time that there was a scandal (and there were alot of those) Pelosi said, "No, that's not it" often to the consternation of her fellow Democrats.

    Almost word for word, what ya'all claimed during ya'all's Russia Collusion delusion phase.. :D

  12. [12] 
    Michale wrote:

    DSWS

    Meanwhile on the scandal du jour, I stand by my previous assessment: this changes nothing. It doesn't matter what the text of any statute is. It doesn't matter what the factual details are. No one who was on Trump's side in the first place will flip-flop because of this.

    Yep...

    And many who are on the fence are going to be pushed to President Trump's side..

  13. [13] 
    Michale wrote:

    The next day, the semi-transcript was released. It was just as bad as everyone expected, because it clearly shows an American president colluding with a foreign leader to provide dirt on his chief political opponent, the man who is leading the polls to run against him next year. Trump, in true Mafia-boss fashion, only coyly hints at a quid pro quo, but the collusion is plain for all to see even without that aspect of it.

    I thought we had established that collusion is NOT a crime??

    So, NOW ya'all are back to the bullshit that collusion IS a crime??

    My gods, you people flip flop so bad it's amazing ya'all could keep your positions straight. :D

    As far as ya'all's quid pro quo bullshit??

    Funny how ya'all scream hysterically about this non existent quid pro quo..

    And yet, you ignore BIDEN'S blatant and CONFESSED quid pro quo...

    Why is that???

    Oh, that's right. Because BIDEN has a -D after his name, so HIS quid pro quo is perfectly acceptable..

  14. [14] 
    Michale wrote:

    Speaking of Biden,

    Democratic presidential candidates are united in condemning President Donald Trump for seeking a foreign country’s help to trash a domestic political rival. But when it comes to defending the president’s target, former Vice President Joe Biden, it’s more complicated.

    Massachusetts Sen. Elizabeth Warren suggested she’d consider barring her vice president’s children from serving on the boards of foreign companies, the very kind of business arrangement Trump has used in unfounded attacks accusing Biden and his son Hunter of corruption.

    When asked whether Trump’s attacks reflect on Biden’s “campaign or his character,” California Sen. Kamala Harris said, “I’ll leave that up to the pundits. I don’t have a comment on that.” And Vermont Sen. Bernie Sanders, who in 2016 defended Hillary Clinton against attacks over her use of a private email server as secretary of state, sidestepped a question about whether the Biden controversy makes him a weaker candidate.

    The reactions signal just how contentious the Democratic primary could become in the months ahead if it unfolds against the backdrop of impeachment proceedings in Congress. Even as Biden’s leading competitors for the Democratic presidential nomination accuse Trump of abusing the power of his office, they have been willing to let Biden navigate the situation on his own.
    https://apnews.com/68f19fffdbdf4638ab94117b83f5c8f1

    Looks like Biden is being thrown under the bus... :D

  15. [15] 
    Michale wrote:

    And, since I KNOW ya'all love polls..

    Biden's numbers have plummeted since this new Collusion delusion popped up..

    And President Trump's numbers continue their meteoric rise..

    Who could have POSSIBLY predicted that Biden would suffer more over this then President Trump..

    Oh... Wait.. :D

  16. [16] 
    Michale wrote:

    The outcome of this scandal (which still hasn't been given a "-gate" name, because events have been moving too fast for the pundits to get that bored) is still unknowable.

    Not factually accurate.

    You yourself have stated the most likely outcome of this faux scandal..

    President Trump remains in office..

    You know it.. I know it.. :D

  17. [17] 
    Michale wrote:

    And now the other shoe drops..

    An unnamed Ukrainian official said that Kiev was not made aware that the U.S. suspended security funds until a month after President Trump's call with his counterpart, Volodymyr Zelensky, which calls into question the whistleblower's account and Democrats' arguments that there was a quid pro quo for the aid.

    The official told the New York Times that Zelensky's government was unaware about the aid issue up until a month after Trump's July 25 phone call where he discussed Joe Biden and his son Hunter.

    The whistleblower complaint—citing U.S. officials—claimed that officials in Kiev were aware that the military aid could be in jeopardy in early August, but the whistleblower admitted to not knowing "how or when they learned of it."
    https://www.foxnews.com/politics/ukrainian-official-appears-to-cast-doubt-on-quid-pro-quo-claim

    Hay Balthy..... Explain something to me..

    How can their be quid pro quo for military aid at the time that the phone call was made, when the Ukrainians didn't even KNOW that the Pentagon had delayed the aid package???

    Looks like ya'all's whistleblower has been PROVEN to be full of shit..

    Who could have POSSIBLY predicted THAT??

    Oh... Wait.. :D

    Let's face the facts, people..

    You have a disgruntled CIA agent who hates Trump and America so he is getting even..

    That is all ya'all have..

    Like ya'all's Russia Collusion delusion, this is going to blow up in ya'all's face...

    And ya think I gloated before!?? :D

  18. [18] 
    Michale wrote:

    The complaint stated that Trump made a “specific request that the Ukrainian leader locate and turn over servers used by the Democratic National Committee (DNC) and examined by the U.S. cybersecurity firm CrowdStrike" -- a request that does not appear in the declassified transcript of the call released by the Trump administration on Tuesday. Trump mentioned CrowdStrike, but did not demand the server.

    Additionally, the complaint said Trump "suggested that Mr. Zelensky might want to keep" his current prosecutor general, a claim not supported by the transcript.

    More bullshit from the disgruntled CIA guy...

    Yep.. Gonna blow up in ya'all's face.. AGAIN..

  19. [19] 
    Michale wrote:

    DSWS

    (from yesterday)

    }}Has ya'all's opinion changed as to President Trump's re-election being all but a sure thing??{{

    Marginally. I have thought all along that Biden is a weak general election candidate, and Elizabeth Warren less so. Now that she's doing better than I expected, that makes me less pessimistic.

    But I'm always pessimistic about politics. Politics is a rotten way to make decisions. In politics, all of us together are stupider than any of us.

    Can't argue with the logic.. :D

    Thank you for having the integrity (not to mention the testicular fortitude :D ) to respond.. :D

  20. [20] 
    Michale wrote:

    Goodwin: Nancy Pelosi will regret rushing into impeachment push

    What a difference a day could have made! Imagine if Nancy Pelosi had held her impeachment fire for 24 hours.

    Then she would have had the transcript of President Trump’s call with the president of Ukraine. Even a quick read would have told her it was not as advertised.

    She would have learned there was no threat from Trump and no talk of a quid pro quo involving foreign aid in exchange for an investigation of Joe Biden. By the time she finished the five pages, Pelosi would have realized that the media’s promise of a smoking gun was a false promise.

    With the facts in front of her, the House speaker would have wisely put off Tuesday’s doomsday impeachment push and waited for a more compelling issue to justify an historic effort to overturn the 2016 presidential election.
    https://nypost.com/2019/09/25/goodwin-nancy-pelosi-will-regret-rushing-into-impeachment-push/

    It's funny.. This is actually TONS worse for the Democrats than their Russia Collusion delusion..

    With the RCD, the American people didn't know if a crime had been committed for almost 2 years.. Of course, Americans finally learned that NO, there was no crime committed..

    In this redux of the RC delusion, Americans already KNOW that there was no crime committed.

    Unlike the RC delusion, Americans HAVE the exact same facts that Democrats have..

    And there CLEARLY is no crime committed..

    Of course, this is a "speed" impeachment.. Pelosi and the Dumbocrats are trying to hurry up and shove this down the country's throat before the American people can put a stop to it..

  21. [21] 
    Michale wrote:

    Instead, Pelosi plunged the country into a nightmare by surrendering to the most radical members of her party and the Trump-hating left-wing press. Political mistakes don’t get much bigger or more consequential.

    Impeachment is now what next year’s election will be about. Not immigration, or health care, or the economy or national security or anything that really matters to the working people across the country. Those who get up and go to work in offices and stores, build the bridges, plow the fields, care for the children and keep us safe are officially now an afterthought to Pelosi’s foolish decision

    Yep.. Democrats will be judged SOLELY and COMPLETELY on their Impeachment albatross...

    And the judgement won't be kind..

    As always, if there is a flaw in my logic, please point it out..

    Silence indicates that ya'all concede the point.. :D

  22. [22] 
    Michale wrote:

    To be sure, the release of the transcript set off reactions in spades, with each side reading into it what they wanted to find. But there is no equivalency between the competing views.

    Impeachment is a yes or no vote on whether a president has committed “high crimes and misdemeanors” that render him unfit for office. While there is no legal test for what constitutes an impeachable offense, there is a common-sense test, which is why the draconian option has been used only sparingly.

    This case doesn’t come close to meeting any rational standard. The left can spin itself dizzy but it is impossible to believe a majority of all Americans will conclude that the president’s words in the transcript justify removing him from office.

    This is what is so moronic about Pelosi's and the Dumbocrat's actions..

    The majority of the American people are completely and 1000% AGAINST impeaching the President..

    And even MORE so on this particular impeachment..

    Democrats really stepped into it this time.. :D

  23. [23] 
    Michale wrote:

    Without having any evidence other than hysterical media accounts that were based on anonymous sources, she decided to jump because she reportedly believed the charges against Trump were serious and yet would be easily understood by the public. She convinced herself of this and declared Tuesday that the phone call showed Trump’s “betrayal of his oath of office, betrayal of our national security and betrayal of the integrity of our elections.”

    Except the transcript shows nothing of the sort and no amount of sophistry can twist it into something it’s not. Pelosi screwed up but every American will pay the price through gridlock in Washington and deepening polarization everywhere.

    Yes, the transcript reports that Trump did raise the issue of Joe Biden’s son’s lucrative job with an energy company in Ukraine, and the then vice president’s threat to withhold American aid unless a prosecutor investigating the company was fired.

    And Trump clearly wanted Ukraine to give Attorney General William Barr any information it has about the origins of the 2016 spying on Trump’s campaign.

    But none of this is the stuff that brings down a presidency.

    If ya'all could take a step back and actually look at this objectively with an eye based in REALITY...

    Ya'all would see how utterly ridiculous this all is..

    At least, with the Russia Collusion delusion, ya'all had a SEMBLANCE of a serious issue.. Working with the enemy to win the election. THAT is serious....

    Asking an ally to look into corruption on it's own soil?? That's NOTHING by comparison..

    And yet, it's THIS bigger nothing burger that Democrats have set their sites on..

    I have to say for it is dead on ballz factually accurate..

    The OLD Weigantia of 10 years ago would NEVER have supported this totally bullshit action of the Democrat Party.

    NEVER...

  24. [24] 
    Michale wrote:

    But this is the Weigantia of today..

    The Weigantia where HHPTDS reigns supreme..

    The Weigantia where ANY action no matter HOW harmful to the country, no matter HOW totally unsupported by facts and reality, no matter HOW hysterical, irrational and illogical..

    Today's Weigantia is where reason and logic and common sense has died...

    What a shame... :(

  25. [25] 
    dsws wrote:

    For the president alone, the document provides one power: to require the opinion in writing of the heads of the executive departments.

    Oops, I left out pardons. That's what I get for trying to cite the Constitution from memory. I know I don't have it memorized, and when I'm at a computer I check. But I was typing on my stupid "smart"phone, where switching tabs is annoying.

    There's also recess appointments, but that's only a special case of the joint power that comes into play when Congress chooses to make itself unavailable.

    The veto is a joint power, a secondary role in the legislative process.

    The role of commander-in-chief isn't a power of the president alone, either. Congress gets to "make Rules for the Government and Regulation of" the military (including the militias of the several states, although that power is held jointly with the state legislatures).

    Finally, there's the vesting clause. Some people want to say that the vesting clause makes the presidency an imperial office, setting him up as almost a dictator. That's hogwash. It means he can do what Congress tells him.

  26. [26] 
    dsws wrote:

    [7] Kick

    This changes public opinion.

    If it does, I'll be surprised. But I've been wrong before.

    Some poll numbers will change, as Democrats and apoliticals start answering questions about an existing inquiry instead of a hypothetical one. It's just the ruling Party that I predict will stay solidly behind its Leader.

  27. [27] 
    Michale wrote:

    This changes public opinion.

    If it does, I'll be surprised. But I've been wrong before.

    It won't...

    Or, to be MORE accurate, it won't in the direction that the Trump haters are hoping.

    New polls show that the numbers of Americans who oppose impeachment has risen considerably in the past week..

    It's just the ruling Party that I predict will stay solidly behind its Leader.

    Absolutely.. It's clear to anyone with more than 2 brain cells to rub together that President Trump won't LOSE any support..

    In other words, his base is loyal. As such, he has no where to go but up..

    And if the polls are to be believed, President Trump is well on his way...

  28. [28] 
    Michale wrote:

    The question I have been pondering is WHY...

    WHY did Pelosi take this step now..

    It's obvious to anyone not enslaved by Party that the Ukraine phone call is a much MUCH *MUCH* weaker case than the Russia Collusion delusion. By about a factor of 10...

    So, WHY would Pelosi take this road, which she has already acknowledged that it's a LOSING road for the Democrats..

    Then it hit me..

    IG Horowitz's Report On The Criminal Activity Of The Obama/Biden Administration During And After The 2016 Presidential Election is due out any day now..

    From ALL indications, this is going to be bad, bad, VERY BAD for the Democrat Party..

    Apparently, Pelosi wants to make sure she has a chance to push it off the front page..

    She will fail.. As damning as Horowitz's report is going to be, it's gonna push Impeachment off the front page..

  29. [29] 
    Michale wrote:

    "I am concerned that, if we don't impeach the President, that he will get re-elected."
    -Rep Al Green

    And now you know... the REST of the story...

  30. [30] 
    TheStig wrote:

    DSWS-2

    Coequal is a real word, but more to the point it is a "term of art" - a word with a specialized meaning within specific disciplines. In this case, lawers and constitutional scholars. Coequal is used in the sense of separation of powers between the 3 branches of government, with no one branch being able to run the government on its own. This implies equal rank.

    There is no real controversy here. The controversy is being manufactured as a smokescreen and or tallking point by some elements of the popular press who specialize in sophistry. It's being lapped up by the poorly informed.

  31. [31] 
    Michale wrote:

    There is no real controversy here. The controversy is being manufactured as a smokescreen and or tallking point by some elements of the popular press who specialize in sophistry. It's being lapped up by the poorly informed.

    Nearly word for word, it's EXACTLY what ya'all said during your Russia Collusion delusion phase..

    But THIS time, yer right, eh?? :D

    It's so cute that you actually BELIEVE that.. :D

    The FACTS, and ya'all's pathetically bad track record, are all on my side, son.. :D

  32. [32] 
    Don Harris wrote:

    Stig-
    Close, but no cigar.

    You are right that there is no real controversy here.

    The controversy is being manufactured as a smokescreen and or talking point by some elements of the popular press and politicians that work for the big money interests.

    It's being lapped up by the poorly informed because that is all they are being offered.

    One "side" says look what the other side did and the other side says your side does it too.

    Citizens on one side want to believe they are the good guys and/or haven't been duped so they rationalize what their side does because it is needed to battle the bad guys that are duping the other side.

    As I said in comment 5 it is all just a distraction to get people all excited that something might happen that never does to keep people from taking any real action that is needed to end the corruption.

    Why do citizens keep accepting what they are offered instead of demanding what they want?

    If our founding fathers behaved that way we would still be singing "God bless the Queen" instead of the Star-Spangled Banner.

    It's time for CW to act like a real American and inform the poorly informed aboot One Demand so they can have the opportunity to act like real Americans instead of frightened little children.

  33. [33] 
    Michale wrote:

    Marc Thiessen: Dem impeachment accusations against Trump not supported by transcript of Trump-Zelensky call
    https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/marc-thiessen-the-rough-transcript-makes-it-clear-that-democrats-got-ahead-of-the-evidence

    This is the one impassable stumbling block in the Democrats push for another coup..

    NOTHING in the phone call is impeachable..

    NOTHING... ZERO... ZILCH... NADA...

    Not a SINGLE person here can point to an impeachable offense in the Trump/Zelensky phone call..

    "But.. But.. But... Quid Pro Quo for American aid!!!" ya'all whine...

    At the time of the call, NO UKRAINIAN even KNEW that the aid was being held up....

    There was absolutely NO MENTION of the pending American aid in the Trump/Zelensky phone call...

    As with their Russia Collusion Delusion, Democrats have NOTHING but spin, rumor and innuendo..

    Anyone with more than 2 brain cells to rub together can see that...

    The fact that ya'all are on another COLLUSION IS A CRIME kick proves how completely obsessed and desperate ya'all are..

    "This is not going to end they way you think it will."
    -Luke Skywalker

  34. [34] 
    Michale wrote:

    But hay... Let's take a look, shall we..

    We know the Trump/America hating CIA Agent that is the whistle blower has lied and bullshitted in his report..

    Let's talk to the people who allegedly TOLD the whistle blower these fairy tales..

    Have them step forward and tell their story FIRST HAND so it's not anonymous hearsay...

    What are Democrats afraid of??

    They're afraid because they KNOW that these phantom witnesses do not exist..

  35. [35] 
    Michale wrote:

    One "side" says look what the other side did and the other side says your side does it too.

    We KNOW that Democrats have engaged in quid pro quo and extortion with Ukraine..

    We know this because Joe Biden BRAGGED about it...

    Funny how, when ya'all scream and whine about President Trump and "quid pro quo" that ya'all have NO FACTS TO SUPPORT.. Funny how ya'all ignore the *FACT* that Democrats were neck deep in quid pro quo and extortion..

    Why is that???

    Why do ya'all scream and yell about non-existent quid pro quo in the Trump/Zelensky phone call, but you ignore the DOCUMENTED quid pro quo and extortion committed by VB Biden on orders from Obama??

    Ya'all won't answer that because ya'all CAN'T answer that...

    And, per ya'alls OWN dictate... SILENCE GIVES ASSENT....

    In this case SILENCE = CONCESSION

    I accept ya'all's concession.. :D

  36. [36] 
    Michale wrote:

    Top Republicans on Thursday pushed to identify the White House officials who told a whistleblower of alleged misconduct by the Trump administration, as Democrats ramped up their impeachment inquiry -- and several apparent inconsistencies emerged in the whistleblower's complaint.

    Republicans specifically questioned why the whistleblower's sources in the White House didn't file a complaint themselves -- especially given that relevant whistleblower procedures do not protect second-hand complaints. (The New York Times reported that the whistleblower is a CIA officer detailed to the White House. Fox News has not confirmed The Times' report.)

    Rep. Andy Biggs, R-Ariz., a member of the House Judiciary Committee, told Fox News' "Shepard Smith Reporting" on Thursday that the administration had an apparent "leak problem," adding, "if they're leaking something that's supposed to be classified, then ... that probably is criminal in nature."

    "Let's find out," Biggs said when Smith asked if he wanted to see the whistleblower's sources.

    Looks like the criminality is all on the Democrat side of this equation.. :D

  37. [37] 
    Michale wrote:

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EFamoH_U8AA1YrJ?format=jpg&name=small
    "We now believe the conspiracy happened somewhere over hear.."
    -Nancy Pelosi

    Hehehehe It's funny cuz it's true..

  38. [38] 
    Michale wrote:

    One FACT that simply cannot be refuted..

    Solomon: These once-secret memos cast doubt on Joe Biden's Ukraine story
    https://thehill.com/opinion/campaign/463307-solomon-these-once-secret-memos-cast-doubt-on-joe-bidens-ukraine-story

    Biden's campaign is history... He will not survive..

    Congrats Dims.. Yer FIRST casualty in this 2nd bullshit coup attempt is one of yer own..

    BBBBWWAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAAHAHAHAHAHA

  39. [39] 
    Michale wrote:

    The controversy ignited anew earlier this year when I disclosed that Joe Biden admitted during a 2018 videotaped speech that, as vice president in March 2016, he threatened to cancel $1 billion in U.S. loan guarantees, to pressure Ukraine’s then-President Petro Poroshenko to fire Shokin.

    At the time, Shokin’s office was investigating Burisma. Shokin told me he was making plans to question Hunter Biden about $3 million in fees that Biden and his partner, Archer, collected from Burisma through their American firm. Documents seized by the FBI in an unrelated case confirm the payments, which in many months totaled more than $166,000.

    Some media outlets have reported that, at the time Joe Biden forced the firing in March 2016, there were no open investigations. Those reports are wrong. A British-based investigation of Burisma's owner was closed down in early 2015 on a technicality when a deadline for documents was not met. But the Ukraine Prosecutor General's office still had two open inquiries in March 2016, according to the official case file provided me. One of those cases involved taxes; the other, allegations of corruption. Burisma announced the cases against it were not closed and settled until January 2017.

    Biden's campaign is toast and Hunter Biden will be lucky to stay out of a Ukraine jail..

    The facts don't lie people..

    And all of ya'all are strangely silent on the facts..

  40. [40] 
    TheStig wrote:

    As for fastest scandal ever - I think we are only seeing the tip of the iceberg.

    Working for the Trump Organization is like playing a complicated Version of Prisoner's Dilemma. Trump is loyal to no one. Those who rat early get better deals from prosecutors. There is no guarantee of a pardon, and defense lawyers eat up lots of money for a very long time.

  41. [41] 
    Michale wrote:

    As for fastest scandal ever - I think we are only seeing the tip of the iceberg.

    Again.. Word for word what you said about the Russia Collusion delusion..

    Working for the Trump Organization is like playing a complicated Version of Prisoner's Dilemma. Trump is loyal to no one.

    And yet, the FACTS prove that you Democrats LOVED Trump..

    When he had a -D after his name.

    So, why should ANYONE think what you have to say is credible???

    Hmmmmmmm No answer??

    I guess that means you concede the point..

    I accept your concession..

  42. [42] 
    TheStig wrote:

    Rudy G. would be wise to flip early. Ask for lenient sentencing (house arrest?) due to age and mental infirmity.

  43. [43] 
    Michale wrote:

    In 2014, Ukrainians, sick of corruption, revolted. Vice President Joe Biden went to Kiev to help the new government. But then something strange happened. Just three weeks later, a Ukrainian natural gas company accused of corruption appoint Hunter Biden — seen here in their promotional videos — to their board of directors, paid his firm more than a million dollars a year. Hunter, a lawyer who had just been discharged from the Navy Reserves for testing positive for cocaine. He had served on other boards, but had no known experience in Ukraine or natural gas.
    -ABC News

    Oh yes... Hunter Biden is going to jail... THAT much is certain...

  44. [44] 
    Michale wrote:

    OK.. So ya'all have had a couple days to review things.

    Later, Trump veers into the Biden issue.

    "I heard you had a prosecutor who was very good and he was shut down, which is really unfair,” Trump says on the call, according to the transcript.

    Trump then says, "There’s a lot of talk about Biden’s son, what Biden stopped the prosecution and a lot of people want to find out about that, so whatever you can do with the attorney general would be great.”

    “Biden went around bragging that he stopped the prosecution, so if you can look into it, It sounds horrible to me,” Trump said on the call, according to the transcript.

    Zelenskiy replies that he’s appointing a new prosecutor who will “look into the situation.”

    That is the only mention about Biden in the transcript of the call. The call transcript is five pages.
    -ABC News

    Can ANY of ya'all point to ANYTHING impeachable there??

    Anything at all???

    Silence = Concession

    I accept ya'all's concessions..

  45. [45] 
    Michale wrote:

    Rudy G. would be wise to flip early. Ask for lenient sentencing (house arrest?) due to age and mental infirmity.

    Once again.. EXACTLY what you said during your Russia Collusion delusion, when you encouraged bit players in THAT faux scandal to do the same thing..

    Ya'all are like a broken record..

  46. [46] 
    nypoet22 wrote:

    in the mueller probe, pretty much everyone DID flip.

  47. [47] 
    nypoet22 wrote:

    it didn't change the outcome of course, but anyone who was not donald or donald's direct relative either flipped or got caught

  48. [48] 
    Michale wrote:

    in the mueller probe, pretty much everyone DID flip.

    Yea.. And what was the result??

    A) The flip'ees got screwed over big time..

    and

    2) President Trump was STILL completely and utterly exonerated for Russia Collusion..

    So, what can we deduce from these two facts??

    Democrats are morons..

    AND

    Follow Stig's advice is moronic..

    Over ta you.. :D

  49. [49] 
    Balthasar wrote:

    Gawd Mike, YOU are the broken record. I whipped you soundly yesterday, and yet you pop up like toast in the morning. To harass people that largely disagree with every second-rate article you spew.

    For the record, it is, and always has been illegal to solicit dirt on your opponent from a foreign source. That's what Trump did. That much is cut and dried.

    Trump also cut military aid to that country a few days before the call. It strains reality to say that this wasn't on Zelensky's mind throughout, or that he didn't know.

    So the rest is just hogwash, cooked up and slathered on thick, to back us off. Fat chance.

  50. [50] 
    Balthasar wrote:

    And we might have it all done by Halloween! Wouldn't that be splendid! If the republicants don't impeach, it gives our candidate a nifty talking point through next year...

  51. [51] 
    nypoet22 wrote:

    @balthasar,

    if i had to guess, that's probably nancy's strategy - to do it quickly and matter-of-factly as possible, and not draw it out, so it's just a talking point rather than a circus.

    JL

  52. [52] 
    nypoet22 wrote:

    which incidentally was gingrich's mistake with clinton.

  53. [53] 
    Balthasar wrote:

    But the White House has largely ignored substantive questions about the allegations. And its strategy appears hinged on hopes that the partisan frenzy stoked both by both the progressive left and Trump himself will cloud out substantive concerns raised by the whistleblower.

    The White House strategy, in close coordination with Trump’s reelection campaign, is aimed at motivating the president’s base supporters to stick with him in 2020.

    But allies suggest there is a risk that the Trump’s team is focusing too much on the campaign at the expense of the perilous Capitol Hill proceedings that lie ahead.

  54. [54] 
    Balthasar wrote:

    nypoet: True.

  55. [55] 
    Michale wrote:

    For the record, it is, and always has been illegal to solicit dirt on your opponent from a foreign source

    No, it has not..

    Show me the law that says that. You can't because it doesn't exist..

    Trump also cut military aid to that country a few days before the call. It strains reality to say that this wasn't on Zelensky's mind throughout, or that he didn't know.

    Not factually accurate.. It was the Pentagon who held up the aid for review purposes..

    And Ukraine didn't know about it until a month after the call..

    Once again, you have NO FACTS.. All you have is bullshit..

    So the rest is just hogwash, cooked up and slathered on thick, to back us off. Fat chance.

    Yea.. You said the same thing about yer Russia Collusion delusion.. Yer a broken record.

    You were wrong then.. You'll be wrong now..

    You have ALWAYS been wrong..

    ALWAYS..

  56. [56] 
    Michale wrote:

    END OF WATCH

    Trooper Tracy Vickers
    Florida Highway Patrol, Florida
    End of Watch: Friday, September 27, 2019

    And remind the few...
    When ill of us they speak...
    That we are all that stands between...
    The monsters and the weak.....

    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/13839e8d10b9303c8d9aee50576e15b15f4844be91d15073a21097a85b780c50.jpg

  57. [57] 
    dsws wrote:

    A sign that I may be mistaken about the lack of impact of the Ukraine situation:
    "Vermont's GOP governor backs Trump impeachment inquiry"
    https://thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/463201-vermonts-gop-governor-backs-trump-impeachment-inquiry

  58. [58] 
    Michale wrote:

    DSWS,

    Not really..

    Vermont Gov Phil Scott is a well documented Trump hater...

    It's like Romney.. It's no surprise they are for impeachment.. They have hated President Trump from day one..

    There are going to be GOP Trump/America haters who will support impeachment.. That's a given. They will support ANYTHING that takes President Trump down..

    So, no.. Yer claim is still valid..

  59. [59] 
    C. R. Stucki wrote:

    Re "GOP Trump haters". The man is awfully easy to hate.

  60. [60] 
    Balthasar wrote:

    “It is illegal for any person to solicit, accept, or receive anything of value from a foreign national in connection with a U.S. election,” FEC chair Ellen Weintraub cautioned in a June statement. “This is not a novel concept. Electoral intervention from foreign governments has been considered unacceptable since the beginnings of our nation.”

    Ukraine didn't know about it until a month after the call..

    Do you really think that? Consider the mechanics of it, contracts delayed, everything on 'hold'. I don't think so.

  61. [61] 
    Michale wrote:

    Re "GOP Trump haters". The man is awfully easy to hate.

    I guess it's a matter of perspective..

    But true or false, it has no bearings on the facts..

    But, glad yer around CRS..

    I am just DYING to hear your perspective on Blathy's bullshit claim:

    For the record, it is, and always has been illegal to solicit dirt on your opponent from a foreign source

    AND the fact that everyone is now back in the COLLUSION IS ILLEGAL groove, after denying it when Mueller exonerated President Trump...

    I know, I know.. It's confusing as hell keeping all their claims straight..

  62. [62] 
    Michale wrote:

    “It is illegal for any person to solicit, accept, or receive anything of value from a foreign national in connection with a U.S. election,” FEC chair Ellen Weintraub cautioned in a June statement. “This is not a novel concept. Electoral intervention from foreign governments has been considered unacceptable since the beginnings of our nation.”

    Which has nothing to do with information..

    Do you really think that? Consider the mechanics of it, contracts delayed, everything on 'hold'. I don't think so.

    It's what the Ukraine Foreign Minister stated..

    But, of course, you won't believe him because it messes with your delusions.

    Just like you didn't believe the NOAA about Dorian..

    You see the pattern??

  63. [63] 
    Kick wrote:

    Balthasar
    49

    For the record, it is, and always has been illegal to solicit dirt on your opponent from a foreign source. That's what Trump did. That much is cut and dried.

    It's not like that fact hasn't been covered over and over ad nauseam on this board either. The FEC made this abundantly clear quite recently in response to Donald Trump's interview with George Stephanopolous where he claimed he'd accept it.

    CHAIR ELLEN L. WEINTRAUB
    FEDERAL ELECTION COMMISSION
    WASHINGTON, D.C. 20463

    Statement Regarding Illegal Contributions
    From Foreign Governments

    June 13, 2019

    Let me make something 100% clear to the American public and anyone running for public office: It is illegal for any person to solicit, accept, or receive anything of value from a foreign national in connection with a U.S. election.(1) This is not a novel concept. Electoral intervention from foreign governments has been considered unacceptable since the beginnings of our nation.Our Founding Fathers sounded the alarm about “foreign Interference, Intrigue, and Influence.”
    They knew that when foreign governments seek to influence American politics, it is always to advance their own interests, not America’s. Anyone who solicits or accepts foreign assistance risks being on the wrong end of a federal investigation. Any political campaign that receives an offer of a prohibited donation from a foreign source should report that offer to the Federal Bureau of Investigation.

    (1) 52 U.S.C. Sec. 30121(a)(2).

    https://www.fec.gov/resources/cms-content/documents/Chair_Weintraub_on_Illegal_Foreign_Contributions.pdf

  64. [64] 
    Balthasar wrote:

    Which has nothing to do with information..

    Bullshit. Information has value. Trump knows that.

    It's what the Ukraine Foreign Minister stated..

    Since I didn't read the statement, I can't comment. I do however, know that stopping nearly half a billion dollars in aid money has repercussions that can't be hidden.

    My guess is that the Ukrainians are scrambling to get out of the way. Zelensky looked very tense at his one-to-one with Trump. After all, he's still on the hook to this crook.

  65. [65] 
    Michale wrote:

    Bullshit. Information has value. Trump knows that.

    Not as far as the FEC is concerned.. Find me the FEC reg that says information is included in their thing of value spiel..

    You can't because....

    Yer wrong.. As usual..

    Since I didn't read the statement, I can't comment.

    And that didn't stop you from commenting, did it.

    This is emblematic of this entire mess..

    You Dumbocrats spewing bullshit that contains NO FACTS...

    My guess is that the Ukrainians are scrambling to get out of the way. Zelensky looked very tense at his one-to-one with Trump. After all, he's still on the hook to this crook.

    Again, that's just your bigoted intolerant opinion.. It's not supported by ANY FACTS whatsoever..

    Once again, you prove my point..

    Ya'all have nothing but bullshit..

    And I have the FACTS...

  66. [66] 
    Michale wrote:

    My guess is that the Ukrainians are scrambling to get out of the way. Zelensky looked very tense at his one-to-one with Trump. After all, he's still on the hook to this crook.

    Funny how you claim you don't have the facts so you can't comment..

    And then you go ahead and comment without ANY facts..

    I just proved how utterly moronic your position is.. :D

  67. [67] 
    Balthasar wrote:

    Just like you didn't believe the NOAA about Dorian..

    Just like I didn't believe the Trump-appointed head of NOAA about Dorian. The scientists at the National Weather Service are all fine with me.

    Do you see the pattern?

  68. [68] 
    Michale wrote:

    @Blathy,

    “It is illegal for any person to solicit, accept, or receive anything of value from a foreign national in connection with a U.S. election,” FEC chair Ellen Weintraub cautioned in a June statement. “This is not a novel concept. Electoral intervention from foreign governments has been considered unacceptable since the beginnings of our nation.”

    And yet, you didn't say ANYTHING when Hillary solicited dirt on Trump from Ukraine..

    Why is that??

  69. [69] 
    Michale wrote:

    You didn't say ANYTHING when Democrats solicited the dossier from a foreign national..

    Why is that??

    Because you know that your claim is full of shit..

  70. [70] 
    Balthasar wrote:

    Not as far as the FEC is concerned..

    Then what was the statement by the FEC head about? I find it odd that it just came out of nowhere.

    And that didn't stop you from commenting, did it.

    Never stopped you.

  71. [71] 
    Michale wrote:

    Just like I didn't believe the Trump-appointed head of NOAA about Dorian. The scientists at the National Weather Service are all fine with me.

    Do you see the pattern?

    Yes.. I see the pattern.. You only believe people who say what you want to hear.

    For you, the NOAA is gospel when it spews about your global warming con..

    But when it states a FACT that you don't like??

    You don't believe it.. Because you can't handle seeing your delusions totally destroyed.

    So, yea.. I see the pattern..

    And it's pathetic..

  72. [72] 
    Michale wrote:

    Then what was the statement by the FEC head about? I find it odd that it just came out of nowhere.

    There was no statement about information in your claim..

    And that didn't stop you from commenting, did it.

    Never stopped you.

    Ahhhh.. So NOW you aspire to be like me.. :D

    I'm flattered...

    BBBWWAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAA

    The difference is, I HAVE the facts to comment.

    You admit you DON'T have facts and yet you STILL comment..

    BBBBWWAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

  73. [73] 
    Balthasar wrote:

    And yet, you didn't say ANYTHING when Hillary solicited dirt on Trump from Ukraine..

    You didn't say ANYTHING when Democrats solicited the dossier from a foreign national..

    Hillary never solicited dirt from Ukraine. The records on Manafort were discovered and turned over to us as a matter of course.

    The Steele dossier wasn't the product of a campaign, nor was it a government.

  74. [74] 
    Michale wrote:

    Hillary never solicited dirt from Ukraine.

    Bullshit claim #1

    The records on Manafort were discovered and turned over to us as a matter of course.

    Irrelevant claim #1

    The Steele dossier wasn't the product of a campaign, nor was it a government.

    Bullshit claim #2 and #3..

    Taking my beautiful wife to lunch now.. I'll be back to kick your ass some more in about an hour...

    "Gonna find my baby gonna hold her tight...
    Gonna grab some afternoon delight..."

    :D

  75. [75] 
    Balthasar wrote:

    But when it states a FACT that you don't like?

    Since when is a statement like that a FACT? There were no facts backing it up.

    There was no statement about information in your claim..

    C'mon, you can't be that dumb.

  76. [76] 
    Kick wrote:

    The President of the United States using the power of the office to investigate his political opponents for personal political gain and sending his latest fixer/personal lawyer through the State Department is using the office of the presidency to promote his own personal interests.

    Impeachable offense: Abuse of Power.

    Rudy going to the Ukraine to get dirt on Biden for Trump's reelection campaign isn't exactly a new revelation. Rudy admitted it in May 2019:

    https://www.nytimes.com/2019/05/09/us/politics/giuliani-ukraine-trump.html

    Donald Trump also had a conversation with Zelensky on April 21. Stay tuned.

  77. [77] 
    Paula wrote:

    In other news:

    The National Rifle Association acted as a "foreign asset" for Russia in the period leading up to the 2016 election, according to a new investigation unveiled Friday by Sen. Ron Wyden, D-Ore.

    Drawing on contemporaneous emails and private interviews, an 18-month probe by the Senate Finance Committee's Democratic staff found that the NRA underwrote political access for Russian nationals Maria Butina and Alexander Torshin more than previously known — even though the two had declared their ties to the Kremlin.

    The report, available here, also describes how closely the gun rights group was involved with organizing a 2015 visit by some of its leaders to Moscow.

    Then-NRA vice president Pete Brownell, who would later become NRA president, was enticed to visit Russia with the promise of personal business opportunities — and the NRA covered a portion of the trip's costs...

    https://www.npr.org/2019/09/27/764879242/nra-was-foreign-asset-to-russia-ahead-of-2016-new-senate-report-reveals

  78. [78] 
    Kick wrote:

    So, WHY would Pelosi take this road, which she has already acknowledged that it's a LOSING road for the Democrats..

    Then it hit me..

    IG Horowitz's Report On The Criminal Activity Of The Obama/Biden Administration During And After The 2016 Presidential Election is due out any day now..

    OMG... the QAnon bullshit! *laughs*

    She will fail.. As damning as Horowitz's report is going to be, it's gonna push Impeachment off the front page..

    Anyone who has bought "all in" to the ridiculous 4Chan QAnon conspiracy bullshit and brings it to this reality based forum needs to have their head forcibly removed from their ass.

  79. [79] 
    Paula wrote:

    From Twitter:

    Ned Price
    @nedprice
    BREAKING: More than 300 former national security professionals, many of whom served presidents of both parties, express alarm at President Trump's actions and endorse the impeachment inquiry in a statement relesed today. https://drive.google.com/file/d/1J7LiS4

  80. [80] 
    Michale wrote:

    Since when is a statement like that a FACT? There were no facts backing it up.

    Which statement of fact are you referring to??

    I make so many statements of FACT to counter your complete and utter bullshit, there are plenty to choose from.

    To which are you referring to??

    C'mon, you can't be that dumb.

    Yer right. I can't be..

    But, apparently, YOU can..

    Because you can't point to ANY claim or reg from the FEC that says information = something of value..

    Once again.. All you have is BULLSHIT..

    All I have are facts...

  81. [81] 
    C. R. Stucki wrote:

    The "Thing of value" phrase CLEARLY refers to things of MONETARY VALUE, for gawdsake people!

    You Democratics gonna tell me that if somebody's political opponent in the race for the office of local County Dogcatcher somewhere in CA is cheating on his wife with a Mexican girl in Tiajuana (sp?), and the dogcatcher candidate finds out about it from a Texan, that's OK for him to use in the campaign, but if he finds out about it from a Mexican, he can't use it???

    There's a point somewhere on the gullibility spectrum where it morphs int stupidity, and when you're already in PTSD shock from the fizzling of the Mueller report, apparantly you are vulnerable to making that transition even quicker than normal.

  82. [82] 
    Michale wrote:

    There are still 12 House Democrats who don't support impeachment proceedings. Why?
    https://www.cnn.com/2019/09/27/politics/house-democrats-impeachment/index.html

    Apparently, not ALL Democrats are on board with impeachment..

    BBBWWAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHA

  83. [83] 
    Michale wrote:

    The "Thing of value" phrase CLEARLY refers to things of MONETARY VALUE, for gawdsake people!

    I know, right..

    But 's OK.. Balthy can't point to a SINGLE FEC statement or reg that equates Information with "thing of value"...

    As usual, he is just spewin' bullshit..

    You Democratics gonna tell me that if somebody's political opponent in the race for the office of local County Dogcatcher somewhere in CA is cheating on his wife with a Mexican girl in Tiajuana (sp?), and the dogcatcher candidate finds out about it from a Texan, that's OK for him to use in the campaign, but if he finds out about it from a Mexican, he can't use it???

    I know, I know.. It's LAUGHABLE...

    There's a point somewhere on the gullibility spectrum where it morphs int stupidity, and when you're already in PTSD shock from the fizzling of the Mueller report, apparantly you are vulnerable to making that transition even quicker than normal.

    heh..

    "It's funny cuz it's true.."
    -Homer Simpson

    And, don't forget... COLLUSION IS A CRIME is now back in vogue here in Weigantia.. :D

  84. [84] 
    Kick wrote:

    FIFY

    Paula

    Here's your link:

    https://tinyurl.com/y65ue8gm

  85. [85] 
    Paula wrote:

    A really good piece:
    The Realist Case for Impeachment
    The U.S. president needs the public’s trust to conduct foreign policy. Donald Trump has forfeited it.

    Make no mistake: this issue is not about whether you agree with Trump’s handling of foreign policy. Every previous president has made foreign-policy mistakes, and some of them were real doozies. George W. Bush’s decision to invade Iraq was a colossal blunder, Barack Obama erred when he helped topple Muammar al-Qaddafi, and Bill Clinton blew it when he rejected Partnership for Peace and opted for full-on NATO expansion or when he fired cruise missiles at a pharmaceutical factory in Sudan. But there’s no evidence that any of them made these decisions to feather their own nests or to tip an election with bogus charges. The closest equivalent that I can think of is Richard Nixon’s efforts to sabotage the Vietnam peace talks in 1968 so that progress at the talks wouldn’t give an edge to Democratic nominee Hubert Humphrey. Tricky Dick wasn’t president yet, however, and we all know how his presidency eventually turned out.

    Remarkably, Trump is now leaving Nixon in the dust. As a private citizen he ran a crooked business, and it’s been clear for a while that he’s running a crooked presidency. He cannot be trusted with the authority of the presidency and the privilege of confidentiality that managing the nation’s foreign and national security policy requires. Why? Because every time he meets with a foreign leader, we won’t know if he is genuinely trying to advance the national interest or just trying to cut a sleazy deal to help himself. Now, his insistence on meeting with leaders such as Russian President Vladimir Putin without any aides present takes on an even more ominous light.

    https://foreignpolicy.com/2019/09/27/the-realist-case-for-impeachment/

  86. [86] 
    Michale wrote:

    Wow.. A big long statement..

    And not a SINGLE FACT to show for it..

    Bottom line for ya'all??

    Trump won..

    Ya'all LOST...

    That's the end of it..

    If ya don't like it..

    Then take him down at the ballot box..

    But, from all indications.. Ya'all are to chicken shit to try it.

    Because you KNOW you will get your asses handed to ya'all.. AGAIN...

    This is the reality.

    Deal with it, snowflakes..

  87. [87] 
    Michale wrote:

    Looks like I scared Blathy away.. :(

    Bummer.. He was kinda fun... :D

  88. [88] 
    Michale wrote:

    https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2020/president/us/2020_democratic_presidential_nomination-6730.html

    Biden numbers are in free fall, thanks to Democrats throwing him under the bus...

    President Trump will likely emerge stronger...

    Joe Biden's campaign is toast..

  89. [89] 
    Michale wrote:

    Patrick Buchanan: Joe Biden: Impeachment's First Casualty

    Even before seeing the transcript of the July 25 call between President Donald Trump and Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky, Nancy Pelosi threw the door wide open to the impeachment of Donald Trump by the Democratic House.

    Though the transcript did not remotely justify the advanced billing of a "quid pro quo," Pelosi set in motion a process that is already producing a sea change in the politics of 2020.

    The great Beltway battle for the balance of this year, and perhaps next, will be over whether the Democrats can effect a coup against a president many of them have never recognized as legitimate and have sought to bring down since before he took the oath of office.
    https://www.cnsnews.com/commentary/patrick-j-buchanan/joe-biden-impeachments-first-casualty

    This is nothing but Democrats and Trump/America haters trying to nullify a free, fair and legal election..

    Nothing else is at play here..

    And it simply won't succeed.. Everyone here recognizes that fact..

  90. [90] 
    Michale wrote:

    Pelosi on Tuesday started this rock rolling down the hill.

    She has made impeachment, which did not even come up in the last Democratic debate, the issue of 2020. She has foreclosed bipartisan compromise on gun control, the cost of prescription drugs and infrastructure. She has just put her own and her party's fate and future on the line.

    With Pelosi's assent that she is now open to impeachment, she turned what was becoming a cold case into a blazing issue. If the Democrats march up impeachment hill, fail and fall back, or if they vote impeachment only to see the Senate exonerate the president, that will be the climactic moment of Pelosi's career. She is betting the future of the House, and her party's hopes of capturing the presidency, on the belief she and her colleagues can persuade the country to support the indictment of a president for high crimes.

    One wonders: Do Democrats blinded by hatred of Trump ever wonder how that 40% of the nation that sees him as the repository of their hopes will react if, rather than beat him at the ballot box, they remove him in this way?

    It's easy to predict the aftermath if, by some weird chance of fate, Democrats succeed in their coup..

    A shooting war.. One side who has 98% of the guns in this country against the other side who are afraid of guns..

    It won't be pretty, but it WILL be quick.. AND decisive..

  91. [91] 
    Michale wrote:

    The first casualty of Pelosi's cause is almost certain to be the front-runner for the party nomination. Joe Biden has already, this past week, fallen behind Sen. Elizabeth Warren in Iowa, New Hampshire and California. The Quinnipiac poll has her taking the lead nationally for the nomination, with Biden dropping into second place for the first time since he announced his candidacy.

    By making Ukraine the focus of the impeachment drive in the House, Pelosi has also assured that the questionable conduct of Biden and son Hunter Biden will be front and center for the next four months before Iowa votes.

    What did Joe do? By his own admission, indeed his boast, as vice president he ordered then-Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko to either fire the prosecutor who was investigating the company that hired Hunter Biden for $50,000 a month or forgo a $1 billion U.S. loan guarantee that Kiev needed to stay current on its debts.

    Biden insists the Ukrainian prosecutor was corrupt, that Hunter had done no wrong, that he himself was unaware of his son's business ties.

    All these assertions have been contradicted or challenged.

    It's obvious to anyone with more than 2 brain cells to rub together..

    Biden is going down.. It's already started..

  92. [92] 
    nypoet22 wrote:

    @m[90]
    that's a direct quote from the confederacy, right?

  93. [93] 
    Michale wrote:

    that's a direct quote from the confederacy, right?

    Nope. A logical and rational conclusion based on the fact that those who oppose President Trump enough to participate in this coup are generally unarmed and afraid of guns.

    If you think an armed conflict between those who are heavily armed and trained and those who are unarmed and afraid of guns and can't function without their lattes and their Priuses would end any other way..

    I await your supporting facts...

  94. [94] 
    Michale wrote:

    OK then.. Moving on...

  95. [95] 
    Michale wrote:

    More bullshit from the Global Warming fanatics has had to be retracted..

    Nature paper on ocean warming retracted
    https://retractionwatch.com/2019/09/25/nature-paper-on-ocean-warming-retracted/

    Amazing how many bullshit claims of hysterical Global Warming have to be retracted...

  96. [96] 
    Paula wrote:

    [84] Kick: thanks!

  97. [97] 
    Kick wrote:

    HEH

    I heard someone say if there were a private vote there would be 30 Republican votes. That's not true. There would be at least 35. ~ Jeff Flake

  98. [98] 
    Kick wrote:

    Paula
    96

    Thank you, first!

    I checked into that list, and I can tell you it's already getting longer. :)

  99. [99] 
    ListenWhenYouHear wrote:

    Ahhhh.. So NOW you aspire to be like me.. :D

    Doubtful! Don’t remember Balthy ever lying to the world that he’d served his community as a commissioned law enforcement officer or claiming to be the resident expert on a subject he knew NOTHING about! Sorry, but getting arrested doesn’t qualify you to claim you are an expert in law enforcement!

    Nor does being married to a female who is “bisexual” make you an expert on the complexities of sexual orientation.

  100. [100] 
    Michale wrote:

    Don’t remember Balthy ever lying to the world that he’d served his community as a commissioned law enforcement officer or claiming to be the resident expert on a subject he knew NOTHING about!

    Yea.. I have never lied about that either..

    But Blathy has lied about anything else..

    Nor does being married to a female who is “bisexual” make you an expert on the complexities of sexual orientation.

    No, it just makes me an expert on morons like you who use their "victim" status as gay to get people to feel sorry for them..

    Once a cockholster always a cockholster.

    BBBBWWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

  101. [101] 
    Kick wrote:

    Russ
    99

    Heh!

    Hey, Russ, did you notice all the whining out of the Trump Trash about the events of this week? It wasn't even that long ago when the Trump cult sycophants were laughing gleefully and begging for impeachment of the President. Fast forward to now, and they're prattling on and on about a "coup." It's like they have no idea what the word "coup" even means. Perhaps in their inherent ignorance, they have simply forgotten that our Founding Fathers were not terrorists outlining a way to illegally overthrow their own government.

    I'd say there's ample evidence that the Trump MAGAts hate the Constitution.

    A shooting war.. One side who has 98% of the guns in this country against the other side who are afraid of guns.. ~ Mike

    Hey, Russ, how does this bullshit of Mike's square with the GOP and their ilk's endless proclamations that every mass shooting is done by a Democrat or the GOP's standard spew of whining and moaning about all the violence in Chicago, Baltimore, and the big cities of America that are "Democrat"? I mean, really: Pick a lane!

    Maybe the uneducated gullible Trump goobers are under the mistaken impression that all those people who live in all those "Democrat" cities that they prattle on and on about are just throwing lots and lots of bullets at each other really, really fast! :)

  102. [102] 
    Paula wrote:

    Pompeo subpoenaed by House Comm. on Foreign Affairs, House Intelligence & House Oversight and Reform. He's been demanded to produce documents he's previously withheld and told: The subpoenaed documents shall be part of the impeachment inquiry and shared among the Committees. Your failure or refusal to comply with the subpoena shall constitute evidence of obstruction of the House’s impeachment inquiry.

    I am loving this. Now that impeachment is happening we're beyond (hopefully for good) the variations of "Dems meeting to consider" doing something. This came down fast and hard. YAY!

  103. [103] 
    Michale wrote:

    But Blathy has lied about anything else..

    That should read, But Blathy has lied about EVERYTHING else..

    For example.

    Blathy lied about their being an impeachable offense in President Trumps phone coversation..

    Blathy lied about there being a quid pro quo for the Ukraine Aid Package when there was no knowledge by the Ukrainians of any delay..

    Blathy lies about EVERYTHING to do with President Trump..

    As do you and most everyone here...

  104. [104] 
    Kick wrote:

    Paula
    102

    Pompeo subpoenaed by House Comm. on Foreign Affairs, House Intelligence & House Oversight and Reform.

    One, two, three: Third time's a charm Committees.

    This came down fast and hard. YAY!

    And Rudy Giuliani thinks it is helpful to throw State under the bus. Isn't that awesome? Subpoena to Rudy in 3... 2... 1...

  105. [105] 
    Michale wrote:

    Pompeo is going to tell Dumbocrats to go frak themselves..

    He has no documents relating to the stated Impeachment purposes..

    Can't wait to see Pompeo bitch-slap the Dumbocrats.. :D

  106. [106] 
    ListenWhenYouHear wrote:

    It's easy to predict the aftermath if, by some weird chance of fate, Democrats succeed in their coup..

    A shooting war.. One side who has 98% of the guns in this country against the other side who are afraid of guns..

    It won't be pretty, but it WILL be quick.. AND decisive..

    WOW! You must be getting terrified if you are already resorting to threats of violence in the event that Trump is removed from office!

    A shooting war.. One side who has 98% of the guns in this country against the other side who are afraid of guns..

    You think that 98% of gun owners are idiots? It’s much more likely that you are the idiot if you think that many gun owners back Trump. When you and your little band of neo-Nazi Trump supporters take up arms against this country, you’ll get to meet people who don’t lie about their valor and service — actual police officers and National Guard members who will put down your little uprising.

    Be sure to tell them how you like to tell people that you were once one of them to make strangers believe that you might know something about law enforcement...they will LOVE to know that about you!

    But you are correct about one thing (such a weird thing to say about anything you post)....it WILL be quick and decisive!!!

  107. [107] 
    Michale wrote:

    Welp, once again I have to leave.. Lovely wife is taking me out for my b-day...

    Ya'all can come out of hiding now...

    BBBBWWAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHA

    See ya'all tomorrow when I'll slap ya around with the facts some more.. :D

  108. [108] 
    Paula wrote:

    [104} Kick: Subpoena to Rudy in 3... 2... 1...

    Can't wait!

  109. [109] 
    ListenWhenYouHear wrote:

    Yea.. I have never lied about that either..

    Remind me which one IS the lie:

    1) You claiming to have been a commissioned law enforcement officer and therefore having expertise in matters concerning law enforcement???

    Or

    2) You admitting that you were never actually a commissioned law enforcement officer, but that you were an MP when you were in the military???

    Or are they BOTH lies? Holy crap, I never even considered that you might also be lying about your serving in the military! If you will lie about serving your community as a LEO, it wouldn’t be that hard to believe you’d lie about serving your country, too! No wonder you never seem to feel shame for the crap you spew on here...

    Stealing honor must come easy to you after all these years of doing it.

  110. [110] 
    Paula wrote:

    [106] Listen: When Comrade Michale threatens violence he proves what sentient people have known all along - all the hifalutin yapping about wanting unlimited guns coz of "constitutional rights" and/or to "fight a tyrannical government" is just so much hogwash. Their real motivations have always been the desire to be able to shoot opponents -- when they lose on the merits, they will try to win by force. That's it, that's all. They're bullies.

    There will probably be some violent outbreaks by some of these thugs when Blotus goes down - that's going to be horrible. But once the GOP decided that constantly ginning up fear/hate/hysteria among susceptible Americans should be coupled with arming those same people out the yin-yang, some kind of reckoning was inevitable. We can only pray it will be limited as even rightwing gun-nuts include people with enough intelligence to know they'll lose a shooting war with the actual authorities as well as enough basic decency to stop short of shooting fellow-citizens over Blotus (however much they may fantasize about it).

  111. [111] 
    ListenWhenYouHear wrote:

    Kick,

    Hey, Russ, how does this bullshit of Mike's square with the GOP and their ilk's endless proclamations that every mass shooting is done by a Democrat or the GOP's standard spew of whining and moaning about all the violence in Chicago, Baltimore, and the big cities of America that are "Democrat"? I mean, really: Pick a lane!

    Seriously! It makes it tough to pin them down when they don’t stand for anything!

    And should we be nice and tell him that informing everyone that his wife is “bisexual” didn’t make us immediately think that she said that because she compares sex with him the same as having sex with another woman?

  112. [112] 
    Paula wrote:

    Another good piece:

    Why do I call it “voter suppression” rather than merely “election meddling” or “interference”? Because as he is wont to do, Trump did precisely what he accuses the Democrats of doing. By soliciting illegal assistance before his 2016 contest with Hillary Clinton and again before his upcoming battle for a second term, Trump purposely took an election partly out of the hands of voters and put it in the hands of foreign nations. The effect, intentional or not, is silencing American voices in their own democracy.

    For years now, we have listened to Republicans frame the pursuit of Trump’s impeachment as subverting the will of the American voter. Rep. Devin Nunes of California, the ranking member of the House Intelligence Committee, must have had the taste of the president’s shoe polish fresh on his tongue during his opening statement Thursday as he claimed that, “in the Democrats’ mania to overturn the 2016 elections, everything they touch gets hopelessly politicized.” The framing is all wrong, however, and impeachment is not merely an investigatory process by which Democrats need to deliberately build their case against Trump. They need to use this to help Americans understand who is truly stealing the vote, and who is truly working against American values.

    ...

    That is why Pelosi should treat this like her most important piece of legislation yet. But the politics are secondary. Nothing else will get done while this is happening, so Democrats shouldn’t even try. Republican support of Trump will not falter, as Adam Serwer explains, the very anti-democratic ideas that pushed Trump towards his criminality are the very ones that his party has been using to undermine our democracy long before he came along. So Democrats, the party that most needs the government to look like it works, should make it work for the American voter by ensuring that their voices are heard and calling out Trump’s suppression for what it is. Impeachment is their only job now, and that is just fine. Given the immense gravity of their task, it will require every bit of their attention.

    https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/political-commentary/democrats-congress-impeachment-pelosi-891853/

  113. [113] 
    ListenWhenYouHear wrote:

    Paula [110],

    Oh, they talk big, but the only ones who might be dumb enough to act are the loners. So while while we might have a few more mass shootings, I do not see a mass uprising ever occurring. They know Trump is full of shit just like the rest of us do, but for them it has become more about attacking whatever liberals support than having a healthy and functioning government.

  114. [114] 
    Kick wrote:

    Paula
    108

    Can't wait!

    Rudy will claim the whole attorney-client privilege thing, but since he's been running around saying he's working for the State Department... he's going to have to pick a lane.

    Maybe they should just let Rudy keep spewing his guts on Fox and save him for last. That would be the intelligent thing to do.

  115. [115] 
    Balthasar wrote:

    Kick: That would be the intelligent thing to do.

    I'm completely with you on that.

  116. [116] 
    Balthasar wrote:

    Great news to finish the week: Spideman is back in the Marvel universe. Well, I like it.

  117. [117] 
    Paula wrote:

    [113] Listen: Yep.

  118. [118] 
    Kick wrote:

    Russ
    111

    Seriously! It makes it tough to pin them down when they don’t stand for anything!

    I know, right!? Democrats do all the mass shootings and urban gun violence... except Democrats don't have guns! They are certainly not known for their ability to connect the dots... even regarding their repetitive asinine spewage.

    And should we be nice and tell him that informing everyone that his wife is “bisexual” didn’t make us immediately think that she said that because she compares sex with him the same as having sex with another woman?

    *laughs* And multiple posters have noted Mike's obvious hatred of women... and as it turns out, Mike just see's every single one of them as somebody his wife would rather "be with" than the purulent festering shit-stain whom she married. :D

  119. [119] 
    Paula wrote:

    As if Ukraine-gate isn't enough, DJT appears to be ending the week on another crime: Reportedly LaPierre of NRA met with Blotus today. Blotus wants the NRA to fund his impeachment defense. LaPierre said they would if he will refuse to approve gun-legislation.

    As Congressmen Lieu and Beyer have already tweeted, such an arrangement is straight up bribery and is a felony.

    --------

    Rep. Don Beyer
    @RepDonBeyer
    Selling public policy actions in return for money is more commonly known as “bribery” and is a federal crime.

  120. [120] 
    Paula wrote:

    First Republican breaks away: Republican Congressman Mark Amodei of Nevada announces support for impeachment.

  121. [121] 
    Kick wrote:

    Russ
    113

    They know Trump is full of shit just like the rest of us do, but for them it has become more about attacking whatever liberals support than having a healthy and functioning government.

    Ain't that the truth! They whine incessantly about their love for the Constitution and 'Merica and patriotism, but they don't give two shits about this country.

    The "dirty little secret" behind their cult-like worship of Benedict Donald is the hatred they've been spoon-fed by the right-wingnut machine and the fact that they believe Trump will "stick it to the libs" for them.

  122. [122] 
    Balthasar wrote:

    First one! Democrats on board. Full steam ahead.

  123. [123] 
    Balthasar wrote:

    Don't forget that Trump showed himself to be allied internationally with the Nationalists, and against the globalists. Nationalists are just dictators, who want to stick a nice label on what they do.

    Unfortunately, the United States has been run by Globalists for the last 90 years or so. What Trump is doing, is UN-doing our global alliances, defense and trade arrangements.

    This is Putin. If the West can become lots of little, independent countries, rather that one large bloc, if sure makes it easier to squeeze.

  124. [124] 
    Kick wrote:

    Balthasar
    115

    I'm completely with you on that.

    We're right about this too, Balthy. Make Rudy sit through witness after witness and watch him hop from program to program -- network to network -- spewing his ignorant guts and bugging out with every word of testimony about him. Just try and shut him up!

    Rudy has been going to the Ukraine since January 2019 and trying to shake them down about the conspiracy bullshit surrounding "CrowdStrike" and the "server"... as if it's one damn server and not hundreds of a cloud-based network. Trump is being snowed by Putin's dezinformatsiya (disinformation) wherein Russia is blaming Ukraine for their handiwork in the 2016 election. They're trying to prove Putin's conspiracy bullshit. The same bullshit Trump was spewing in Helsinki.

    Go back and read the transcript from Helsinki... the very last questions at the end of the presser from Jonathan Lemire. See if it rings any bells when compared to the telephone call Trump had with Zelensky:

    Trump: I would like you to do us a favor though because our country has been through a lot and Ukraine knows a lot about it. I would like you to find out what happened with this whole situation with Ukraine, they say Crowdstrike... I guess you have one of your wealthy people... The server, they say Ukraine has it. There are a lot of things that went on, the whole situation. I think you're surrounding yourself with some of the same people. I would like to have the Attorney General call you or your people and I would like you to get to the bottom of it. As you saw yesterday, that whole nonsense ended with a very poor performance by a man named Robert Mueller, an incompetent performance, but they say a lot of it started with Ukraine. Whatever you can do, it's very important that you do it if that's possible.
    ...
    Trump: Good because I heard you had a prosecutor who was very good and he was shut down and that's really unfair. A lot of people are talking about that, the way they shut your very good prosecutor down and you had some very bad people involved.

    No one would describe Viktor Shokin as "very good" except Putin... who is still leading Trump around by the nose with the conspiracy theory bullshit about the DNC hacking themselves and the Seth Rich murder, etc. etc!

    Trump and Giuliani have bought "all in" to Putin's dezinformatsiya and trying to rewrite the Mueller Report and clear himself, Manafort, and Stone while at the same time squashing Biden... using the State Department and taxpayers' dollars.

    Bottom Line: "All The President's Men" are covering up for Trump's abuse of power.

  125. [125] 
    Kick wrote:

    Paula
    120

    First Republican breaks away: Republican Congressman Mark Amodei of Nevada announces support for impeachment.

    Trumpertantrum on Twitter in 3... 2... 1!

  126. [126] 
    Paula wrote:

    And, first resignation: Kurt Volker, Special Envoy to Ukraine, steps down.

  127. [127] 
    Paula wrote:

    [125] Kick: Yep!

  128. [128] 
    Paula wrote:

    On Hardball: "It was Volker who introduced Rudy Giuliani to a key Ukrainian official as Giuliani sought dirt on Joe Biden. "

  129. [129] 
    Paula wrote:

    CNN
    @CNN
    White House aides took remarkable steps to keep President Trump's phone calls with Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman and Russian leader Vladimir Putin from becoming public, according to people familiar with the matter.

  130. [130] 
    Elizabeth Miller wrote:

    So, what do you have to say about that, Paula, or is this just another news streaming site?

  131. [131] 
    Paula wrote:

    [130] EM: As CW wrote, this is the fastest scandal ever. Stuff just keeps breaking, with ramifications like Volker stepping down. The fact that the WH was misusing their servers-storage to hide phone calls with Ukraine was bad enough - but if same was occurring with Saudi Arabia and Putin - whoo boy.

  132. [132] 
    Kick wrote:

    So Donald Trump declared war on the Intelligence Community even before he was sworn into office...

    and then once in the office, the Trump administration decided to hide all their evidence on the system belonging to the Intelligence Community.

    Ba-dum-bum-CHING=tssss!

  133. [133] 
    ListenWhenYouHear wrote:

    The Guardian reports:

    Audio was released of Trump expressing a wish to know the identity of the whistleblower’s sources and alluding to retaliation against those officials. Trump said: “I want to know who’s the person, who’s the person who gave the whistleblower the information? Because that’s close to a spy. You know what we used to do in the old days when we were smart?”

    Whistleblowers are NOT spies...they are often the real HEROES in these cases!

  134. [134] 
    ListenWhenYouHear wrote:

    If the “rough transcription” has created this much of a furor, can you imagine just how horrible it is going to be once we actually see what the DOJ hid behind the multiple ellipsis used when quoting Trump. The ellipsis occurred right when Trump was starting to describe exactly what he wanted from the Ukraine.

  135. [135] 
    Kick wrote:

    Trump told Russian officials in 2017 he wasn’t concerned about Moscow’s interference in U.S. election

    President Trump told two senior Russian officials in a 2017 Oval Office meeting that he was unconcerned about Moscow’s interference in the U.S. election because the United States did the same in other countries, an assertion that prompted alarmed White House officials to limit access to the remarks to an unusually small number of people, according to three former officials with knowledge of the matter.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/trump-told-russian-officials-in-2017-he-wasnt-concerned-about-moscows-interference-in-us-election/2019/09/27/b20a8bc8-e159-11e9-b199-f638bf2c340f_story.html

    The day after he fired Comey!?

  136. [136] 
    Kick wrote:

    Russ
    133

    There's video too, Russ:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WOptKNyxqok

    A closed-door gathering with U.S. diplomats in New York, and what does Trump do? Whine like a little bitch about Biden and the Whistleblower.

  137. [137] 
    Paula wrote:

    [135] Kick - yes, another breaking story. From who, I wonder?

  138. [138] 
    ListenWhenYouHear wrote:

    Kick [136]

    A closed-door gathering with U.S. diplomats in New York, and what does Trump do? Whine like a little bitch about Biden and the Whistleblower.

    He did a little more than just whine...he called those that would be called on to provide testimony in the impeachment hearings “spies” and made clear that he believed that the “spies” deserved to be executed for speaking out against him.

    This is Trump’s brilliant presidency:

    The call between Trump and the Ukrainian President occurs the day after Robert Mueller testifies about the Russian interference in our 2016 elections.

    Trump threatens anyone involved in the Whistleblower complaint the day after Pelosi announces the impeachment process has officially started.

    Timing is everything!

  139. [139] 
    Kick wrote:

    Russ
    138

    Yep! :)

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