Looks like the The Hennepin County Medical Examiner's report matches the independent autopsy and officially declares the death a homicide.

Yes, sir. Such are the perils when the dipshits who falsely make claims repeatedly regarding "expertise" and decades as a "law enforcement officer" and keep stating their obvious ridiculous opinions as "facts"... only to have the Hennepin County examiner whom they insist is the "REAL Medical Examiner" to deliver a gut punch to their hysterical "facts."

Mike's definition of the "REAL Medical Examiner" has declared:

Cause of death: Cardiopulmonary arrest complicating law enforcement subdual, restraint, and neck compression

Manner of death: Homicide

How injury occurred: Decedent experienced a cardiopulmonary arrest while being restrained by law enforcement officer(s)

https://content.govdelivery.com/attachments/MNHENNE/2020/06/01/file_attachments/1464238/2020-3700%20Floyd,%20George%20Perry%20Update%206.1.2020.pdf

Appears the officers' lawyers have their "mitigating circumstances" with which to hang their case on, but it has definitely been determined by two autopsies that the officers were a causative factor in the homicide of Mr. Floyd, and there are all those eyewitnesses begging the officers to take his knee off his neck and allow him to breathe. Mr. Floyd was face down on the ground and had already been restrained and rear-cuffed with four officers standing over him lying prone in the street. What were they afraid he was going to do if they didn't also smash his face into a paved surface and deprive him of oxygen for multiple minutes and when he stopped moving and became unresponsive and one of the officers took his vitals and declared he couldn't find a pulse to continue in the same fashion for nearly another 3 minutes without ceasing?

106,407 Americans dead from Coronavirus and counting...

You needn't remind us that President "I Alone Can Fix It" -- now commonly referred to as BunkerBitch -- was tweeting from his bunker that governors should be doing his job.

It is, however, infinitely laughable that BunkerBitch was blaming "Democrat Mayors and Governors" when there were protests in all 50 of these United States with not all of them having a Democratic governor. Trump is not just a pathological lying whiny incompetent president, he's also a clueless one.

One cop simply does his job and, all of the sudden, Covid-19 is NOT a threat anymore..

COVID-19 was always a threat, even though dipshits like yourself, Rush Limbaugh, and Donald Trump repeatedly referred to it it terms of "decidedly non-serious," "hoax," and "the common cold." It's still a threat and still killing Americans due to Trump's incompetence.

People are encouraged by Democrats and Trump/America haters to ignore social distancing and gather in close proximity by the hundreds, thousands even...

So you seem to have forgotten that Donald Trump ordered Americans all across the country back to work while the GOP useful idiots arranged for protesters to storm state capitals and GOP-affiliated groups to sue their governors to open:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/andrewsolender/2020/04/30/armed-protesters-storm-michigan-state-house-over-covid-19-lockdown/#224cdaa69b5cpoutrage then?

And now you watch to whine like a hypocritical little bitch about protesters?

That's the Democrat Party.. Doesn't know it's ass from a hole in the ground... :eyeroll:

Keep rolling your eyes, hypocrite. Maybe you'll find a brain cell back there.

Fair enough.. Even though Z was performing his duties as, essentially, LE for the property he was tasked to protect, you can make a case that it's similar.. ~ Mike

Mike now finally seems to have come around that Zimmerman was "essentially law enforcement"... what you and I and others here in Weigantia had referred to as Zimmerman being a "wanna-be" with Mike insisting he wasn't.

Weigantia Trivia: Who Said It?

Racist or not, Zimmerman has since proven that he is a loose cannon who had no business stalking the neighborhood as a law enforcement wanna-be - much less do so while packing heat. Racist or not, he killed someone who would not be dead if he'd listened to the police dispatch and hung back instead of giving chase. Personally I think it highly unlikely that race wasn't at least part of the equation - racial profiling is pretty well-documented among both law enforcement and nosy neighbors. ~ ________________
..................... ^^ Who said it? ^^

Answer:

http://www.chrisweigant.com/2014/10/07/a-marriage-equality-victory-lap/#comment-53419

No Cheating!

In the link is a video of them turning the lights off. That is some heavy optics. Hiding in a bunker sending off threatening tweets instead of leading a nation when it needs it.

Trump finally surrendered to the coronavirus he claimed was simply a "Democrat hoax" has at last quarantined himself.

#BunkerBitch

105,850 Americans dead from Coronavirus and counting...

Wow... so according to Mike's own metric that he voluntarily set as the Weigantia standard for measuring the proficiency of presidents, that unequivocally makes Donald Trump an exponentially incompetent fool.

What is Odumbo's leadership called when over 12 THOUSAND Americans died..

Let me put it this way.. When we get to the end of this and less than 6,000 Americans died under President Trump's leadership..

Will you finally concede that President Trump did better than Odumbo??

12,269 quatloos (the same number of deaths under Odumbo) says you won't..

http://www.chrisweigant.com/2020/03/20/ftp566/#comment-156171

Mike's own voluntarily created measuring system for incompetence is now perilously off course by ~100,000 dead Americans. Tough break for Americans because of Trump and dipshits like Mike who shouldn't be surprised in the least if neither Mike himself nor his Orange Worship doesn't fare well when measured by the metric of his own making.

Keep those coronavirus reports coming; work that MikeMetric® with every fiber of your being. Mike didn't create that thing by which presidents must be measured only to have it be relegated to the dustbin of Weigantian history.

I have spoken. :)

Think we're going to watch TENET tonight.. It looks pretty good albeit convoluted..

I'll be back tomorrow morning to utterly decimate ya'all's arguments.. AGAIN! :D

Oh and I got notified my surgery is for noon on Weds.. So ya'all will have Weds and Thu to lick yer wounds and bruised egos.. :D

See ya'all tomorrow.. :D

OH.... One more thing..

14 TRILLION in slave reparations!!

BBBBWWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Oh my gods, that STILL is so fraking hilarious!!!!!! :D

BBBBWWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Oh my gods, that is so fraking comical!!! :D

And Dumbocrats and Trump/America haters buy into this utter crap hook, line and sinker!! :D

I see yer back after getting bitch slapped all day yesterday...

Still afraid to make a wager as to who will win the Nov election??

BBBWWWWAAAAAAAAAAAAKKKKKKKK

The fact is, son... I have been factually accurate on EVERY President Trump prediction to date..

And YA'ALL have **ALWAYS** been wrong..

So, of course I am going to dominate Weigantia.. No one can stand against the facts.. :D

"You can't win!! I have GOD on my side!!!"
-Leland Gant, NEEDFUL THINGS

:D

You have a happy day.. :D

Apparently, THAT black American's lively hood did not matter... :eyeroll:

Oh gee.. Which autopsy to believe??

The one done by a REAL Medical Examiner??

Or the one that was paid for by the family of the deceased..

Awww Gee.... Let me think.... :eyeroll:

BBBBWWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Whew!! That is so fraking funny!!!!! :D

Police and soldiers return fire, killing man in Louisville

Police Chief Steve Conrad confirmed the shooting happened around 12:15 a.m. outside a food market on West Broadway, where police and the National Guard had been called to break up a large group of people gathering in defiance of the city's curfew.
https://www.fox5ny.com/news/police-and-soldiers-return-fire-killing-man-in-louisville

Law and order will be maintained....

It's THAT simple...

And NOW we see exactly why a civilian needs an AR-15 with a 50 round magazine.....

BBBBWWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Whew!! That is HILARIOUS!!! :D

BBBBWWWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Oh wow!!! THAT is funny!!!

These morons tear down communities, destroy people's businesses and lives, loot and pillage..

And on top of THAT, they want "reparations"???

BBBBBWWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

And ya'all **REALLY** think that Dumbocrats have a chance in Nov???

THAT is even funnier!! :D

Dumbocrats couldn't fight their way out of a paper bag...

GOP leaders in FL are taking care of business...

Dumbocrats (so-called) leaders need to pay attention...

"Give it to 'im good, Carrie!!! Give it to 'im good!!"
-Girls, CAROUSEL

:D

America is lucky to have a leader of President Trump's caliber.... :D

Eh.... Was OK.. Not nearly as funny as I thought it would be...

Anyone here watch it??

One cop simply does his job and, all of the sudden, Covid-19 is NOT a threat anymore..

People are encouraged by Democrats and Trump/America haters to ignore social distancing and gather in close proximity by the hundreds, thousands even...

That's the Democrat Party.. Doesn't know it's ass from a hole in the ground... :eyeroll:

Neither did Zimmerman/Martin. In both cases the killers were non-police, so if we're going to exclude one incident on those grounds then the other shouldn't be relevant either.

Fair enough.. Even though Z was performing his duties as, essentially, LE for the property he was tasked to protect, you can make a case that it's similar..

I'll give you that one because it's not really relevant..

So, what's your beef about cops in the Aubrey case???

Heading back home now.. Will check with ya when I get there...

In the link is a video of them turning the lights off. That is some heavy optics. Hiding in a bunker sending off threatening tweets instead of leading a nation when it needs it.

105,850 Americans dead from Coronavirus and counting...

https://abcnews.go.com/US/gregory-mcmichael-police-officer-charged-killing-ahmaud-arbery/story?id=70690972

It's an interesting case where the cop and his son pursued a citizen and killed him.

But I'll be honest.. Since it didn't really involve cops, yer going to have a hard time making a "relevance" case...

You've claimed repeatedly on this forum to have 2-1/2 decades of law enforcement based on you being an MP in the armed forces and you used to post the officers KIA as if you were one of their brethren until Russ called you on your bullshit, yet now you insist that Gregory McMichael who actually is an ex-police officer charged with killing Ahmaud Arbery doesn't involve a cop.

*laughs* *can't stop laughing* *spew alert* *rolling on the floor* *pounding fists on floor while laughing*

Russ! Bet you can't read that bullshit of Mike's and not get a hernia or otherwise hurt yourself while laughing. :)

Neither did Zimmerman/Martin. In both cases the killers were non-police, so if we're going to exclude one incident on those grounds then the other shouldn't be relevant either.

JL

As a matter of fact, do ya'all know the MOST dangerous neighborhood in the world for black Americans???

Baltimore.

A neighborhood where upwards of 30,000 black Americans die every year??

COMBINED....

If you seriously believe all those diseases combined "snuffed out" less than 30,000 black American lives, then you're dumber than a box of rocks and you're also contradicting your other bullshit above where where you claimed "blacks" killed 50,000 other black people.

That neighborhood is the womb...

It's obvious you believe your empty head is a neighborhood people live in, but that doesn't mean a woman's womb is one too.

So, please remind me again how "Black Lives Matter"??

I seem to have forgotten what with all the FACTS to the contrary...

So then, using your own metric, white "neighborhoods" are by far deadlier and have been exponentially so than black ones. Good thing Barack Obama's mother decided not to abort her white child. Oh, wait! Say... y'all don't think it's possible that a white woman could have a black man's child and vice versa, do you? Well, color me surprised!

Your systemic racism rears it's pathetic head again, and you've proven without doubt that whites are far and away the biggest killers of the unborn. Congratulations, moron.

I am heading into the shop for a few..

I'll address your points (if there are any) when I get there...

It's actually comical in a sad and pathetic way..

You are correct about that but not likely in the way you believe you are.

Black looters and protesters say "Cops are murdering our people" yet the BIGGEST killer of blacks (upwards of 50,000 per year) are other blacks...

You seem to be clueless that a "black" can be a cop and would still qualify as a black killing a black and also that (1) heart disease, (2) cancer, (3) unintentional accidents, (4) strokes, (5) diabetes mellitus, and (6) chronic lower respiratory diseases are all "bigger killers of blacks" than (7) assault (homicide) regardless of the color of the killer.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/233310/distribution-of-the-10-leading-causes-of-death-among-african-americans/

This is why it's IMPOSSIBLE to take the claims of systemic/institutionalize racism seriously..

Shhhhhhhhhhhh. No one tell Mike that a black person could actually be a cop.

The facts clearly show that it's blacks who killed THOUSANDS, TENS of thousands more blacks than police do...

You're the poster child for the very definition of systemic racism. Reminds me of that joke where some farmers are examining the pasture to determine whether or not a lump they've come across is cow dung to avoid or soil they can walk through:

Farmer 1: "It looks like shit."
Farmer 2: "It smells like shit."
Farmer 3: "It tastes like shit."
In unison: "Sure glad we didn't step in it!"

Looters and scumbags just HAVE to know they are in deep kimchee when the T-1000 starts knocking them!! :D

I think the Ahmaud Arbery case is the one this forum seems to be avoiding, so maybe that would be a better place to continue.

By all means.. State your case...

A neighborhood where upwards of 30,000 black Americans die every year??

A neighborhood where black American lives are snuffed out more than Police, HIV, Homicide, Diabetes, Accident, Cancer, and Heart Disease....

COMBINED....

That neighborhood is the womb...

So, please remind me again how "Black Lives Matter"??

I seem to have forgotten what with all the FACTS to the contrary...

I think the Ahmaud Arbery case is the one this forum seems to be avoiding, so maybe that would be a better place to continue.

I see what you did there... and you're "oh so" clever and correct, of course.

Black looters and protesters say "Cops are murdering our people" yet the BIGGEST killer of blacks (upwards of 50,000 per year) are other blacks...

This is why it's IMPOSSIBLE to take the claims of systemic/institutionalize racism seriously..

The facts clearly show that it's blacks who killed THOUSANDS, TENS of thousands more blacks than police do...

Yea, and yer link is from the NY Grime.. No wonder you tried to hide it with a tinyurl...

I shortened a long ass link to a PDF of the actual law enforcement document containing the charges against the office with the quotes from the preliminary autopsy.

You supplied bullshit and no link... but definitely the evidence you're a fabricating uneducated bullshit artist.

He made a conscious decision to fight the law..

The law won..

Hell, even RUSS agrees with me...

That fact alone should tell ya'all how utterly and completely wrong ya'all are...

We can discuss Breonna Taylor if ya'all are tired of getting your asses whoop'ed on Floyd... :D

an initial medical examiner's report found "no physical findings that support a diagnosis of traumatic asphyxia or strangulation" -- and cited Floyd's "underlying health conditions including coronary artery disease and hypertensive heart disease," as well as the "potential intoxicants" in his system.
https://www.newsweek.com/george-floyd-couldnt-breathe-before-he-was-pinned-down-cops-prosecutor-says-1507608

Am I good or what!!??? :D

Yea, and yer link is from the NY Grime.. No wonder you tried to hide it with a tinyurl...

BBBBBWWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Looks like DeBlowHole is caught between and a hard case.. :D

And let's recap the big news from yesterday..

The preliminary autopsy report quotes came from the Medical Examiner's quotes which were included in the charges of former Officer Chauvin that weren't from "yesterday" but were rather from Friday, May 29.

According to the autopsy, Floyd died due to his coronary artery disease (something I am intimately familiar with), his hypertension and his heart disease..

Coronary artery disease and heart disease. *laughs* Do you have a link to this autopsy or are you referring to the preliminary findings?

Floyd also had likely intoxicants in his system..

You've moved the goalpost from "possible intoxicants" to "likely intoxicants," two entirely different definitions. Link, please.

So, at the time of death he was likely high or drunk or both..

Link, please.

The legitimate restraint move that Officer Chauvin was forced to use on a combative Floyd???

Not relevant at all to his death...

Link, please. I have a link:

The Hennepin County Medical Examiner (ME) conducted Mr. Floyd's autopsy on May 26, 2020. The full report of the ME is pending but the ME has made the following preliminary findings. The autopsy revealed no physical findings that support a diagnosis of traumatic asphyxia or strangulation. Mr. Floyd had underlying health conditions including coronary artery disease and hypertensive heart disease. The combined effects of Mr. Floyd being restrained by the police, his underlying health conditions and any potential intoxicants in his system likely contributed to his death.

The defendant had his knee on Mr. Floyd's neck for 8 minutes and 46 seconds in total. Two minutes and 53
seconds of this was after Mr. Floyd was non-responsive. Police are trained that this type of restraint with a
subject in a prone position is inherently dangerous.

Defendant is in custody.

https://tinyurl.com/ybdbt3vu

[ emphasis added by me ]

It's almost as if someone PREDICTED this the day before..

It's "almost" as if someone "predicted" on May 30 what had already been widely reported all over the Internet on May 29. Oh, wait! And has demonstrable trouble with the written word and reading comprehension. *laughs*

And definitely no evidence whatsoever of any discernible "law enforcement expertise" he keeps claiming.

"How can you shoot women and children!!!???"
"It's easy.. You just don't lead 'em as much!!"
-FULL METAL JACKET

:D

Lights that normally illuminate the exterior of the White House were disabled early Monday morning, reportedly so that the Secret Service could use night-vision equipment to monitor protesters.

I would LOVE to be on the front lines at the White House...

Oh please, please, PLEASE....

Looters and scumbags... PLEASE try to breach the White House walls... I would LOVE to see that!! :D

Let's ask Trayvon Martin... :^/

What would Trayvon Martin know about attacking a cop? He was neither killed for attacking a cop nor did he receive a trial by jury, which is the way America deals with alleged perpetrators of crime(s)... unless you don't believe in or practice the Constitution.

You definitely seem to be advocating extrajudicial killing with your comment I quoted above, and that's not something to make light of or encourage in this comments section (or anywhere else on the Internet, for that matter) unless you're looking for a surefire way to prove without any doubt at all that you were in no way whatsoever the "law enforcement officer" that you claim.

So, ya'all will probably get a couple days respite..

Yunno..... gather yerselves.. Lick your wounds... That sort of thing..

"Hay, what can I say, it's OK... Yer weclome..."
-Maui, MOANA

:D

Haven't seen MC since he got bitch-slapped to hell and back...

Blathy is gleefully looking up how many Americans are dead.. He is as giddy as a school-boy...

Liz and JL are probably still sleeping....

So, looks like I got the playground to myself for a bit.. :D

According to the autopsy, Floyd died due to his coronary artery disease (something I am intimately familiar with), his hypertension and his heart disease.. Floyd also had likely intoxicants in his system.. So, at the time of death he was likely high or drunk or both..

The legitimate restraint move that Officer Chauvin was forced to use on a combative Floyd???

Not relevant at all to his death...

It's almost as if someone PREDICTED this the day before..

Oh... wait...

"It was me!!"
-Judy Robinson, LOST IN SPACE

:D

What about you.. You wanted to talk about the Breonna Taylor shooting and then you disappeared once I proved it was a Good Shoot...

Don't you want to talk about Taylor any more???

Oh wow...

Shits getting real for DeBlowhole...

He's gonna have to choose sides real soon..

You can certainly thank me for the verbal shooting of my middle finger at your repetitive bullshit, but you can't factually thank anyone for a concession you didn't receive from them. :)

What about you???

Did you find any facts to support your claim that cops "World Wide" are taught to NOT use a knee to the neck as a restraining technique..

Hell, even RUSS says yer full of shit on that point...

When Russ and I are totally and unequivocally on the same page you just GOTS ta know that you are as wrong as wrong can be....

I thank you for your concession...

Mayor: ‘We’re not going to tolerate it in our city. We’re not going to let them burn our city to the ground.’
https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2020/05/31/sheriff-several-officers-attacked-1-stabbed-in-neck-amid-jacksonville-protests/

We have a special way of dealing with protesters and looters and other assorted scumbags who attack cops..

Is it effective??

Let's ask Trayvon Martin... :^/

But hay.. I'll be yer huckleberry... Show me any systemic racism here in the United States..

Bring facts... RELEVANT facts...

Oh, FFS! Go look in the mirror, and you'll find the dipshit who's claimed on more than one occasion that the "Democrat Party" is full of racists; you know, that right-wing talking point wherein the GOP tries desperately to claim "black Americans" are slaves to a Party who views them as inferior.

Now you're howling at the moon that racism doesn't exist and undercutting your own Trumplican Party's insistence that racism is alive and well and living in Democrats... a sizeable chunk who happen to be "black Americans" themselves, but obviously are outnumbered by millions. It's like you're so effing blind to your own racist spew that you don't even listen to your own bullshit talking points!

Thank you for highlighting your own ignorance, though. You making your own talking points look ridiculous is nothing new here since you're illiterate and have a reading comprehension problem even in regards to your own oft repeated word stench and "fabricated and pulled straight out of your own fat ass" bullshit.

Also, when your Trumplican Party and Orange Worship keep stating on a regular basis that politicians of color should "go back to the country they came from," then you don't get to claim racism doesn't exist in our institutions while Hair Dick Tater keeps insisting that persons of color aren't from America and an American judge who happens to be of Latino heritage cannot judge him impartially because he's a Mexican. Plenty more where that came from insisting that the African American President of the United States show his papers and prove he wasn't born in Africa... appealing to racists for political gain is the perpetuation of systemic racism.

So to recap: Racism is alive and well in America and living in the White House and frequently in your comments where you parrot the shit like a useful idiot sheeple performing on cue.

It's amazing to me that there are people here in Weigantia who actually SUPPORT the looters and scumbags...

Boggles the mind..

"What is your boggle?"
-Museum Patron, DEMOLITION MAN

Nope... Not getting tired of winning at all..

What about ya'all??? Ya'all getting tired of losing??

Just asking... :D

This is what happens when moron Democrats let the looters and destroyers "blow off steam"....

Hmmmmm

Oh, here's a good one.. :D

And just like that... Covid-19 is no big deal whatsoever...
http://sjfm.us/pics/justlike.jpg

I really have to wonder if ya'all can really comprehend how badly Democrats are losing all over the country??

SO... Can we dispense with the complete and utter BS that Dr King would support these riots and looters and murderers??

That's a new low.. Even for Weigantia....

She continues, “Martin Luther King preached love, not hate; peace, not violence; universal brotherhood, not racism.” This MLK isn’t easy to square with the figure now being portrayed by the media, but the Fourth Estate can’t be bothered with facts right now. It’s an election year. They have to stoke as much racial tension as possible.

Anyone who mis-uses Dr MLK's words to justify hate and bigotry and violence and burning and murdering and looting and pillaging.....

They ought to be well and truly ashamed of themselves...

Funny how morons here in Weigantia only cherry pick the quotes that allow OTHER morons to hate and destroy and burn and murder and loot and pillage...

Does anyone here stand with me and Dr MLK and AGAINST the violence and hate and looting and pillaging???

Anyone?? Anyone stand against the rioters and the looters???

Anyone???

This grotesque misrepresentation of Dr. King’s views is only possible by cynically cherry-picking eight words from a 1966 interview during which he repeatedly emphasized that violence was counterproductive to the progress of the civil rights movement. Mike Wallace interviewed him for “CBS Reports” on Sept. 27, 1966, and the primary topic of discussion involved divisions within the movement concerning overall strategy. The myth that King had somehow endorsed violence went mainstream in 2013, when “60 Minutes Rewind” posted a clip from the Wallace interview and irresponsibly titled it using the same out-of-context quote. The interview transcript begins with this unambiguous statement:

What kind of scumbag would twist a great man's words to justify hate and violence and murder and looting and burning and destroying???

Answer: Blathy...

The media distort Martin Luther King’s words to render riots respectable.
https://spectator.org/misquoting-mlk-to-legitimize-violence/

Hmmmm

Who do we know that used MLK's words to justify all the burning and destroying and looting and killing???

“In the final analysis, a riot is the language of the unheard. And what is it that America has failed to hear?”-MLK
-Blathy

Why, it was our very own Blathy who stooped so low as to do that..

Not surprising, eh?? :eyeroll:

You have no idea what I'm proposing or you just like coming off as being obtuse.

Just as soon as people around started yelling at police that the guy can't breathe - well, that should have sent alarm bells off in the officers' heads and the knee should have been removed from the neck as Floyd wasn't going anywhere while handcuffed and on his stomach.
-Liz

It sounds like you were for giving criminals control over how they are treated by police...

If that was not what you mean, by all means.. Please clarify..

I'm done with you on this issue unless you demonstrate some reading comprehension.

TRANSLATION
I am going to try and ignore you until you start commenting and thinking the way *I* want you to comment and think...

Yer in for a LONG wait, Liz.. Until you start showing some FACTS that are relevant, we'll never have any common ground..

For example.. We know now for a fact that the autopsy proves that the police restraining technique used by Officer Chauvin was not responsible in ANY way for Floyd's death..

As I predicted, it was Floyd's heart condition, his coronary artery disease and his hypertension that killed him.. Not to mention the possible alcohol/drugs in his system..

In other words, Floyd was a dead man walking and Officer Chauvin's actions had no bearing on Floyd's death..

These are the kinds of relevant facts that you people need to have if ya'all want to debate this issue intelligently...

Typical Dumbocrats.. Trying to shift the blame away from Democrat thugs and terrorists...

So lame..

Michale, give your pince-nez a quick wipe down... I said systemic, not institutionalized. Systemic racism is racism being pervasive or inherent to a body or group.

Now yer just being obtuse.. Systemic and institutionalized are interchangeable..

But hay.. I'll be yer huckleberry... Show me any systemic racism here in the United States..

Bring facts... RELEVANT facts...

An example would be the early days of the USA when slavery was a business that affected all levels of society.

So, you have to go back over 200 years to make your case???

I was referring more to the here and now..

Please show me examples of systemic/institutionalized racism. Bring relevant facts...

But before we start, do you even KNOW the difference between systemic/institutionalized racism and plain old vanilla racism???

OK... GO...

OK, now that Russ has chimed in, here is my 2 cents on what you asked about the George Zimmerman (whom I happen to actually know personally) case..

Exactly what Russ said.. :D

Great post, Russ!

Did race play any role in how the officers reacted/acted on the call? What would have been done differently if the suspect had been white?

It's a great question. I can only tell you what I've experienced from decades of being me... not a person of color (POC) but a "white person" with long dark hair who has enough native American ancestry that when I tan, I can appear darker than some POCs. Believe me when I tell you that I am treated very differently when I'm dark brown. I've even heard racial slurs about me when my own extended family members didn't recognize me at a family reunion: "Who's the n______ b_____?" "I'm his daughter." I said, and watched the asshole standing next to my father start begging for mercy. *laughs*

I was also being treated like a criminal for speeding a couple years back until I showed the officer my credentials, and he literally got down on his knees and apologized to me and begged me not to report him. I reported him. Why? Because bad police officers don't just imperil the citizens, they're also a threat to the excellent cops, and I do believe the majority of cops deserve not to be judged by the bad ones. I'm sure I don't have to tell you that, though.

I guess what bothers me so much is that the media pushes that these events were racially motivated acts by the police when there is nothing that suggests that is true.

I hear you.

Did race play any role in how the officers reacted/acted on the call?

Well, ask yourself if you believe the former police officer turned defendant would have treated Mr. Floyd differently if he was -- all things being equal -- a white man. I would wager the officer wouldn't have been as scared of Mr. Floyd White and probably wouldn't have been afraid of Mr. "White" once he already had him cuffed and four other officers standing over him and holding him down. What could Mr. "White" have done to any them with his hands already restrained behind his back in a four-to-one scenario? I would wager the knee would not have been applied to Mr. "White"... on the ground... with handcuffs placed upon him and hands thusly restrained.

So Floyd resisted arrest according to the charges. Okay, but then he was handcuffed, and resisting arrest is not a license to kill. What matters in the least is what Mr. Floyd did before he was handcuffed; what matters in the instant case is what former officer and now the accused did to Mr. Floyd after he was rear-cuffed and debilitated lying face down and on the ground.

It wasn't mentioned in the report, but Mr. Floyd told the officer: "Don't kill me," and "I'm about to die." Yet Chauvin continued kneeling on his neck. I believe a white man with his hands already cuffed behind him and pinned on the ground by officers that outnumbered him four to one would likely have been given the benefit of the doubt that he was in distress and couldn't breathe. I believe a lot of this disparity in treatment is caused by white officers who are afraid and/or who harbor feelings they won't admit to themselves.

So in the instant case, even if Mr. Floyd was UTI and had health conditions that may have been a contributing factor in his death, it does not appear he would have been killed were it not for Chauvin's pinning him down after he had already been restrained and rear-cuffed. What was Chauvin afraid Mr. Floyd would do with no firearm, no hands, and with four officers standing over him? The Medical Examiner has already listed his actions as a contributory cause of his death. If a judge or jury finds that Mr. Floyd would be alive but for the defendant officer's actions, then that officer could be convicted in his death... albeit with maybe some "mitigating circumstances" that could factor into a lesser sentencing, different charge, or even an acquittal if a full autopsy reveals that Mr. Floyd had a heart attack.

As for two rookies and the other officer that haven't yet been charged, it doesn't look like they'll be getting their jobs back in Minneapolis since their boss believes they're "complicit."

More evidence. Bring it.

Always good to talk with you, Russ. XOXOXO I have spoken. ;)

however, i don't think it's relevant to bring up the trayvon martin incident by way of comparison. a lot more is now public about that case, and the verdict was delivered for a number of reasons that have nothing to do with whether or not zimmerman's actions were correct or justified.

I was not meaning to compare the death of Trayvon Martin with that of George Floyd. What I was trying to compare was just how the media ran with their own version of reality for what supposedly happened and how they represented Martin not as a muscular 18 yo young man in great physical shape (the guy was ripped), but as a pre-teen CHILD by only showing photos of him as a child. Martin had lots of photos online that were current, but those photos did not match the press’ story telling.

And as for that link you offered, those are comments/opinions from people not actually involved in the case. Did you watch the trial? I did! It was pathetic! The prosecution literally only offered evidence that supported George Zimmerman’s account of what happened. The audio of the 911 call where you can hear someone screaming as they were getting their ass kicked....there is no way that wasn’t GZ!

And did you not see the interview with the juror named Maddie (I think that was her name)? She admitted that when the trial started, she really was determined to get justice for Trayvon’s mother because she felt so horrible for her. She however quickly realized that Zimmerman had definitely acted in self-defense based on how the law defines it. She said it became very clear to her that charges should never have been filed and believed that the prosecution must have been doing it merely for show.

I cannot find the article I read at the time (I think it was the full transcript from ABC), but I did find this one that links to the video.

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2013/07/did-george-zimmerman-get-away-with-murder-no-juror-b29-is-being-framed.html

CNN's Sara Sidner stops mid sentence to ask the Minneapolis Police Chief Medaria Arradondo a question on behalf of George Floyd's family. This was the first direct communication the Floyd family has had with the police department.

"Silence is an action — you’re complicit. You’re complicit," Arradondo said, adding “Mr. Floyd died in our hands and so I see that as being complicit” while removing his hat after learning the question had come from the Floyd family.

https://edition.cnn.com/videos/us/2020/06/01/george-floyd-family-minneapolis-police-chief-question-sidner-sot-vpx.cnn/video/playlists/top-news-videos/

So the officers were fired for cause, but only if you believe Minneapolis Police Chief Medaria Arradondo, who most likely fired them.

More evidence. Bring it.

Exactly. And isn't it also possible they didn't follow other procedures since they were all fired and one of them was charged with multiple counts of murder. That's all I'm saying: Show me the facts before I make a conclusion in either direction.

I completely agree with you! I wanted to clarify my reason for saying I thought the officer’s were fired to appease the will of the masses and not based on the results of an official investigation — this event had every factor needed to cause it to trigger the Perfect Storm of the public’s rage! So while I was saying I didn’t think the officers’ were necessarily fired for reason, I do not fault the city for taking that action —I would understand if they hoped that firing them might prevent the city from burning. If that was the case, they were acting in the best interest of the public. While it sucks for the officers’ reputations, hopefully it will all get cleared up as soon as it is safe to do so.

I doubt Russ enjoyed you putting all those words in his mouth as much as your mouth seemed to have enjoyed giving him all that slavish lip service. *laughs*

Yeah, it gets me nauseated every time I see my name being mentioned in his posts. While I might agree with some of the points Mike makes, I find myself going back and reviewing my statements anytime he mentions me just to make sure I worded everything properly.

I guess what bothers me so much is that the media pushes that these events were racially motivated acts by the police when there is nothing that suggests that is true. Did race play any role in how the officers reacted/acted on the call? What would have been done differently if the suspect had been white? White people who resist arrest are physically forced to comply every day. I know some will jump on this comment with “But did they die as a result?” For the vast majority...NO, they didn’t. Nor did the vast majority of blacks that have to be physically forced to comply with lawful commands! Floyd’s death seems it could be a repeat of what happened to Eric Garner — his overall health and previous medical conditions were not able to handle his choice to physically resist arrest. And it just looks horrible anytime someone is screaming “I cannot breathe” over and over goes unconscious and later dies. But sadly, the act of screaming is viewed as evidence that the person is not in respiratory distress as they claim. And since the medics had already been called, and if he had a pulse and was still breathing, I do not know what more they could have done.

Still, I know that his screams are what haunts those that view the video. The officers appear heartless for not jumping to do something to help him. The public doesn’t realize how often people placed under arrest cry wolf complaining of medical emergencies. As an EMT, I do not remember ever witnessing an intoxicated subject who resisted arrest ever NOT screaming that the police were breaking their wrists or claiming loudly that they couldn’t breathe when the officers had to use force to get them in handcuffs.

I fear that the Russians and/or Republicans will fan the flames of racial division in the hopes of disenfranchising black voters from participating in the upcoming election. We know the Russians did this prior to the 2016 election; so to think this isn’t going to happen again would be foolish.

Stay well, my friend. Always a joy to chat with ya!

R

They continued for nearly 60 minutes to try to revive him to no avail. He was only then pronounced deceased 90 minutes after his initial encounter with Minneapolis police.

George Floyd showed no signs of life from time EMS arrived, fire department report says

https://www.startribune.com/first-responders-worked-nearly-an-hour-to-save-floyd-before-he-was-pronounced-dead/570806682/

"The crew found an off-duty firefighter who reported witnessing the end of the struggle and watched as Floyd turned unresponsive in police custody." Mr. Floyd showed no signs of life from the time EMS arrived... not likely just a coincidental heart condition that caused his death but "the combined effects of Mr. Floyd being restrained by the police, his underlying health conditions and any potential intoxicants in his system likely contributed to his death," just to quote the preliminary report of the Medical Examiner.

I still don't think it was the officer's intent to kill the man, but there is ample evidence that the action/inaction of the defendant officer could have been a contributing factor in Mr. Floyd's death, which is why he's been charged with 3rd degree murder and manslaughter as those terms are defined in Minnesota law and not Murder 1.

More evidence. Bring it.

No shit! Former Officer Chauvin was charged with two counts of murder on May 29, and this news was widely reported all over the Internet and national news along with the charge including the verbiage from the preliminary autopsy on the same day : Friday, May 29.

https://tinyurl.com/ybdbt3vu

You claiming you "predicted" on May 30 what had already been reported and posted on the Internet the day before isn't such a surprise. You "predicting" that a big man had a "heart defect" is part and parcel of your regularly displayed lack of medical knowledge, and you or anyone else "predicting" a big man Floyd's age might show signs of heart disease and hypertension on autopsy... again... NO SHIT!

an initial medical examiner's report found "no physical findings that support a diagnosis of traumatic asphyxia or strangulation" -- and cited Floyd's "underlying health conditions including coronary artery disease and hypertensive heart disease," as well as the "potential intoxicants" in his system.
News Report, Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 12:37 UTC

Am I good or what!!??? :D

"Good"? For being able to find verbiage that backs up your "prediction" that was made after the charge was posted!? Let's just say I would wager no one was impressed when you made a "prediction" that a big man about your age might have a "heart defect" *laughs* when it was reported all over Hell and half of Georgia that *shocker* a big man his age had signs of CAD and hypertension. No duh!

Also, you probably should have compared the charges against the officer that actually contained the verbiage from the autopsy report instead of believing the "News Report, Sunday, May 31st, 2020 at 12:37 UTC." You keep claiming to be this officer with all this LEO "expertise," yet you consulted a "News Report" from Sunday two days after the charge posted all over the Internet. *laughs*

State the obvious, but wouldn't a so-called self-proclaimed "officer" of your so-called claimed "expertise" and "experience" check the actual charge? *laughs* Duh! It's been reported all over the Internet as has been posted on there since May 29!

COUNT I

Charge: Murder - 3rd Degree - Perpetrating Eminently Dangerous Act and Evincing Depraved Mind
Minnesota Statute: 609.195 (a), with reference to: 609.195 (a)
Maximum Sentence: 25 YEARS
Offense Level: Felony
Offense Date (on or about): 05/25/2020
Control # : 20200338

Charge Description: That on or about May 25, 2020, in Hennepin County, Minnesota, Derek Michael Chauvin caused the death of George Floyd by perpetrating an act eminently dangerous to others and evincing a depraved mind, without regard for human life.

COUNT II

Charge: Manslaughter - 2nd Degree - Culpable Negligence Creating Unreasonable Risk
Minnesota Statute: 609.205 (1), with reference to: 609.205
Maximum Sentence: 10 YEARS AND/OR $20,000
Offense Level: Felony
Offense Date (on or about) 05/25/2020
Control ICR # : 20200338

Charge Description: That on or about May 25, 2020, in Hennepin County, Minnesota, Derek Michael Chauvin caused the death of George Floyd by his culpable negligence, creating an unreasonable risk and taking a chance of causing death or great bodily harm to George Floyd.

link above

I won't quote the entire document, but I will supply some relevant excerpts copied verbatim and posted below:

* Officer Lane handcuffed Mr.Floyd. Mr. Floyd actively resisted being handcuffed.

* Once handcuffed, Mr. Floyd became compliant and walked with Officer Lane to the sidewalk and sat on the ground at Officer Lane's direction.

* Officers Kueng and Lane stood Mr. Floyd up and attempted to walk Mr. Floyd to their squad car (MPD 320) at 8:14 p.m. Mr. Floyd stiffened up, fell to the ground, and told the officers he was claustrophobic.

* MPD Officers Derek Chauvin (the defendant) and Tou Thoa then arrived in a separate squad car. The officers made several attempts to get Mr. Floyd in the back seat of squad 320 from the driver's side.

* Mr. Floyd did not voluntarily get in the car and struggled with the officers by intentionally falling down, saying he was not going in the car, and refusing to stand still. Mr. Floyd is over six feet tall and weighs more than 200 pounds.

While standing outside the car, Mr. Floyd began saying and repeating that he could not breathe. The defendant went to the passenger side and tried to get Mr. Floyd into the car from that side and Lane and Kueng assisted.
The defendant pulled Mr. Floyd out of the passenger side of the squad car at 8:19:38 and Mr. Floyd went to the ground face down and still handcuffed. Kueng held Mr. Floyd's back and Lane held his legs. The defendant placed his left knee in the area of Mr.Floyd's head and neck. Mr. Floyd said, “I can't breathe” multiple times and repeatedly said, “Mama” and “please," as well. The defendant and the other two officers stayed in their positions.

The officers said, “You are talking fine to Mr. Floyd as he continued to move back and forth. Lane asked,
“Should we roll him on his side?" and the defendant said, “No, staying put where we got him." Officer Lane
said, “I am worried about excited delirium or whatever." The defendant said, “That's why we have him on his
stomach." None of the three officers moved from their positions.

BWC video shows Mr. Floyd continued to move and breathe. At 8:24:24, Mr. Floyd stopped moving. At 8:25:31 the video appears to show Mr. Floyd ceasing to breathe or speak. Lane said, “want to roll him on his side.” Kueng checked Mr. Floyd's right wrist for a pulse and said, “I couldn't find one. None of the officers moved from their positions.

At 8:27:24, the defendant removed his knee from Mr. Floyd's neck. An ambulance and emergency medical personnel arrived, the officers placed Mr. Floyd on a gurney, and the ambulance left the scene. Mr. Floyd
was pronounced dead at Hennepin County Medical Center.

The Hennepin County Medical Examiner (ME) conducted Mr. Floyd's autopsy on May 26, 2020. The full report of the ME is pending but the ME has made the following preliminary findings. The autopsy revealed
no physical findings that support a diagnosis of traumatic asphyxia or strangulation. Mr. Floyd had
underlying health conditions including coronary artery disease and hypertensive heart disease. The combined effects of Mr. Floyd being restrained by the police, his underlying health conditions and any potential intoxicants in his system likely contributed to his death.

The defendant had his knee on Mr. Floyd's neck for 8 minutes and 46 seconds in total. Two minutes and 53
seconds of this was after Mr. Floyd was non-responsive. Police are trained that this type of restraint with a
subject in a prone position is inherently dangerous.

Defendant is in custody.

So to recap: The charges clearly state that the Medical Examiner's preliminary findings are that the actions by the defendant, the former Officer Chauvin, were a contributing factor in Mr. Floyd's death.

Russ had stated that Mr. Floyd died after he arrived at the hospital. The actual charge states that another officer stated aloud that he couldn't find a pulse after checking Mr. Floyd, that Mr. Floyd was placed in the ambulance and pronounced deceased at the hospital.

Being pronounced deceased at a hospital and dying at a hospital are two different things so we'll definitely need the medical information from the EMTs in order to determine the state of Mr. Floyd while in transport. I would not assume Mr. Floyd was alive when placed in the ambulance until there is evidence to prove it, neither would I assume he was dead when placed in the ambulance until there was further evidence to prove that.

Although, I will say this: I do not believe former Officer Chauvin would now be charged with two counts of murder if Mr. Floyd actually had a pulse when he was examined by the EMTs. Seems highly unlikely, but then again, nothing surprises me these days.

Need more evidence. I would wager the Minnesota authorities already have this evidence, and I cannot fathom why they'd charge an officer with murder if Mr. Floyd was alive when placed in the ambulance.

I have spoken.

And gleeful Blathy gives us the hourly death count...

Just look at how happy Blathy is about dead Americans..

You set the metric on this yourself, moron, and they're just kicking your ass on a regular basis on this issue because of your own ignorance and declaration that the virus was "decidedly non-serious." It was indeed you who insisted on judging Trump's "low death count" by Obama's for H1N1, and now you're getting your ass kicked by your own metric. You shouldn't confuse those reporting your ignorance (which grows by the hour) and Trump's utter obvious incompetence with someone being happy about all the death he's caused.

So to recap: You set the metric by which they are kicking your ass. If anyone else here enjoyed the deaths and incompetence of Donald Trump, they'd likely be voting for him. As far as reality, it appears you're the only one here who would even consider voting for Trump, and that definitely makes you the "sick fuck" (your term/your projection).

Hell, even RUSS knows you are full of shit about that...

I doubt Russ enjoyed you putting all those words in his mouth as much as your mouth seemed to have enjoyed giving him all that slavish lip service. *laughs*

As with ALL arrests, there is one common factor.. ALL the Subjects made a conscious decision to A> break the law and B> fight/resist arrest..

Wrong. People get arrested who have not broken the law. Mistakes happen. Your claim that all arrests are "a conscious decision to break the law or fight/resist" is ample evidence that you have no idea whatsoever what you're talking about. Your so-called "expertise" is a load of bullshit.

Police cannot be held responsible for the actions of the Subjects...

Yes, moron, if a police officer takes an action that causes a subject to take an illegal action that results in a violation of law, the police officer most certainly can be held negligent or partly negligent for a subject's actions; it depends on the circumstances of the incident. A police officer's actions and a subject's subsequent illegal reactions might also be "mitigating factors" or "mitigating circumstances" in a subject's case.

Example:

Mattingly and the other officers fired more than 20 shots into Taylor’s apartment, striking her at least eight times and killing her, according to a lawsuit filed by her family. Walker, who was not injured, was subsequently charged with the attempted murder of a police officer and aggravated assault.

Breonna Taylor's boyfriend, Kenneth Walker, 27, was charged with attempted murder of a police officer and first-degree assault for shooting a Louisville, Ky., police officer March 13, 2020, when they forced their way into Taylor's apartment and shot her to death. The charges against Walker have since been dismissed.

https://www.fox23.com/news/trending/charges-dropped-against-breonna-taylors-boyfriend-police-chief-retires-fbi-joins-probe/MDUWBEGADNHSVKIWVV3G42BZLA/

Police on scene followed proper procedure.. This is fact..

Your examples of your decades of "expertise" are laughable, and repeating your opinion over and over does not make it a fact.

The decision to fire the officers and prosecute one of them was ***SOLELY*** a political decision and had no bearing on guilt or innocence...

The fact is, you have no idea if it was "SOLELY" a political decision or not. Perhaps when the eyewitness video evidence and bodycam evidence was compared with the officer(s) report of the incident, perhaps they were found to have filed a bit of fiction. Who knows? You certainly do NOT.

Where is the PROOF he was resisting arrest at all??? We have multiple videos showing.

^^^ This. ^^^

This. ----> Again, where is the EVIDENCE of either RESISTANCE or NON COMPLIANCE at any point???

While I agree with your assessment, I would point out that their was no official investigation conducted prior to the firings.

Exactly my point, Russ. I'm saying that based on the evidence to date which is preliminary -- the eyewitness video, the police bodycam evidence, the officers' reports, etc. -- the officers were fired. Based on that evidence alone, I cannot fathom how anyone could come to the conclusion that these officers did everything according to procedure. I also said "show me the facts." Mike declares these officers "did everything according to procedure" based on that evidence? Bullshit! Mike's claim that everything was done according to procedure by all the officers based on that evidence alone is no less a declaration based on emotionalism than anyone else claiming they're totally guilty based on the same evidence.

This was about the politics of this horrible tragedy; facts be damned!

That could be the case, but then again, the charging authorities have seen more evidence than we have (to date) and have fired every one of them and charged one of them on multiple counts of murder... not exactly the kind of evidence that points to a conclusion of "everything according to procedure."

The officers might be guilty of not paying attention to someone in their custody that they had requested medics to respond for — but that is my two cents based on what video has been released thus far.

Exactly. And isn't it also possible they didn't follow other procedures since they were all fired and one of them was charged with multiple counts of murder. That's all I'm saying: Show me the facts before I make a conclusion in either direction.

So to recap: It is no less "hysterical" and based on "emotionalism" for one to keep insisting the officer(s) did "everything according to procedure" than it is for anyone else to insist the officer(s) murdered a man.

I have spoken. ~ Kuiil, "The Mandalorian"

"Oh.. For those who wanted stats???

In 2019, 41 unarmed people were shot and killed by police in the US...

19 of those people were white..

How come I didn't hear a PEEP out of ya'all when those 19 were killed???

I guess, in ya'all's book, their lives don't matter..

:eyeroll:

According to Statista 1004 people were shot and killed by police in 2019...Shame on you and your invented facts, and to think, for the last couple of years I've treated all your facts as unassailable truths as if they were handed down to you chiseled in stone...

:eyesole:

LL&P

Now facts and information are at your disposal, use them wisely, it's an awesome responsibility I intrust you with, don't be going all right-wing and Trumpy-white lie with this prize, I'd hate for it to become diluted, or worse, gaslighted from misuse...

LL&P

Absolutely, positively, unequivocally!

Obviously, every case is different and deserves accurate analysis.

Consider the case of Eric Garner, who was killed by a New York police officer’s chokehold in 2014. Although the NYPD had a formal policy barring chokeholds, it was frequently unenforced. The city’s Civilian Complaint Review Board received 219 chokehold complaints against NYPD officers in just one year.

Even the NYPD bars choke holds, not that bad cops comply. On the other hand, it does help prove my point...

OK, this is one that drives me nuts...because people are using the wrong terminology for what are very specific, technical holds. Eric Garner was never placed in a “choke hold”. How can I prove this? A death that is the result of a “choke hold” is called a “strangulation”. That was not Eric Garner’s cause of death. As someone who wrestled and did some ground fighting, the video clearly shows that the officer had Garner in what is called a “headlock”, not a “choke hold” or even a “sleeper hold”. The ME’s report noted some bruising on his neck, but no damage to the windpipe.

And, FYI... when you are fighting someone who is attempting to take your gun from you and you are trying to get them under control... making sure your headlock doesn’t turn into a chokehold when the person you are fighting has a thumb in your eye really is not your top priority. Better to have accidentally used an illegal move than to be dead is the point I am trying to make!

You have no idea what I'm proposing or you just like coming off as being obtuse.

I'm done with you on this issue unless you demonstrate some reading comprehension.

Even if this was factually accurate, how does changing police procedures help with criminal's obesity and heart disease??

Asking for a friend... :D

Just as soon as people around started yelling at police that the guy can't breathe - well, that should have sent alarm bells off in the officers' heads and the knee should have been removed from the neck as Floyd wasn't going anywhere while handcuffed and on his stomach.

And what if the criminal being arrested was lying in order to try and get the upper hand on the officer???

Are you suggesting that cops SHOULD let criminals dictate how they (the criminals) are arrested??

"Please officer!! I know I just butchered an entire family in that home invasion!! But these cuffs are too tight and I can't breath!!"

The problem with your suggestion Liz (and don't think I am picking on you.. Everyone here (sans Russ) has the exact same problem) is you don't realize we are talking about CRIMINALS.. Oft times VIOLENT criminals who will fight and, given the chance, KILL cops...

In what reality is it feasible or advisable to listen to a combative criminal who is asking the cops, "Please be nice and let me stand up so I can continue to fight you, maybe get your gun and kill you... Please..."???

I am sorry to be so harsh, but that's what you are, in effect, saying..

That cops should be nicer and more considerate to criminals...

But, apparently, ONLY black criminals... The 19 unarmed white guys who died at the hands of cops in 2019??

Frak them...

Do you see the utter illogic of what you (and everyone else, sans Russ) are proposing???

Where is the PROOF he was resisting arrest at all??? We have multiple videos showing:

Again, where is the EVIDENCE of either RESISTANCE or NON COMPLIANCE at any point???

As I stated above in my response to Liz, we can see what looks like a struggle taking place in the video from across the street. The evidence is on the police’s bodycam footage that we are not privy to. Why do I believe this? Because the police want to avoid any physical confrontations as much as possible since this is the shitstorm that can happen! If you think they just randomly decide to take on a man who is 6’7” and probably 260 lbs or more in broad daylight for kicks, I doubt anything I say is going to matter.

And to your third point, the officer being where he was positioned guaranteed that Floyd was not going to be able to further resist; it was not that Floyd was actively resisting. It is a technique for physically controlling the person in custody’s movements. For all mammals: if you control the head, the body must follow! The knee on the neck prevents the cuffed person from being able to stand up.

And yet, more people AREN'T dying in police custody...

But Russ asked a legitimate question.. Do you suggest that police NOT be allowed to use force when making arrests??

How, exactly, would that work???

It is more tragic [than Floyd dying] that the press has chosen to continue with their “white police officers murdering innocent blacks who were just minding their own business” campaign as it results in the riots we are experiencing now!

Well, I'm looking at this and other similar incidents from the perspective of how police operate. If one person dies while in police custody, while handcuffed and in the presence of four officers, then something needs to change.

Just as soon as people around started yelling at police that the guy can't breathe - well, that should have sent alarm bells off in the officers' heads and the knee should have been removed from the neck as Floyd wasn't going anywhere while handcuffed and on his stomach.

Just because Floyd appeared unconscious, that doesn’t mean the police would change how they were treating him.

As problems go, I'd say you've got one right there - and reason enough to see more people dying while in police custody.

As Russ said, it's unfortunate that the media would turn this into a racist incident..

Unfortunate, but wholly unsurprising.. It's the EXACT playbook they used in the Trayvon Martin shooting, the Michael Brown shooting, the Eric Garner death and the Freddie Gray death...

I mean, it's amazing to me that ya'all actually still believe the media's bullshit...

Right up until there is no apparent pulse on the guy resisting arrest and the non-lethal method continues for some period of time longer.

The officers had called in for medics to respond, and while I do not know what this department’s specific guidelines are for how closely they must monitor a person in their custody, I have said from the beginning that I thought the officer should have been monitoring Floyd better than he did. Again, that is really up to what their department’s SOP instructs. As someone with a long history of asthma, I am very aware of how positional asphyxiation can occur when someone is belly down on the ground and are unable to move.

One thing to remember is that the officer only puts pressure on the neck to counteract the person’s attempts to get up...they don’t put weight on the neck when the person isn’t struggling, but they might choose to keep their knee on the neck to make sure the person in custody remains compliant until they can put him in a vehicle. It’s not unheard of for someone who is in handcuffs to take off running or to spit on the officer or to start kicking the officer. If they are kept on the ground, face down, those things do not happen. Since they were waiting for the medics to arrive, it could be that was why the officer kept Floyd where he was — we just do not know.

What we do know is that the officer’s did not take actions that directly resulted in Floyd’s death. They did not choke him. They did not shoot him. It may be argued that they did not help him as much as they “could have” (or possibly “should have”), but that is not the same as claiming they committed murder.

Do I think that the officer’s may have been charged just to calm the masses — Yes...they can always drop the charges or reduce them down the road once this is no longer on people’s minds. They were fired before formal investigations could be conducted... so you tell me why the city would choose to rush to judgement in cases like this if it wasn’t in the hope that doing so might prevent the city from burning?

But, why did the officers use force? Because the guy was resisting arrest? What was the basis for probable cause to arrest him in the first place?

From the video shot by the security camera across the street from where Floyd died...we see one set of officers arrive and talk to the store owner while two others go and interview Floyd and his passenger. Floyd is shaky in his movements — the officer has to help him to sit down and then get back up when they walk him over to be ID’d by the store owner that claimed he was trying to pass a fake twenty. Unfortunately, another patrol car pulls up and blocks the view of the officers and Floyd when they attempted to place him under arrest. We can see what looks like a flurry of movement by multiple people in what appears to be a struggle through the window of the patrol car, but it is not very clear. I did see someone had a photo of the four officers holding Floyd on the ground (one on his neck, one on his back, one on his waist, and one on his feet) after they handcuffed him.

If a person resists arrest and the police have to physically engage them, once they have the person under control, the police’s main focus is to keep them compliant until they can get them in a vehicle. Just because Floyd appeared unconscious, that doesn’t mean the police would change how they were treating him. The one officer did check his pulse and the lack of CPR starting makes me believe that he still had a pulse. The medics did not immediately start CPR when they arrived (or I should say that I have not seen any report that says they did immediately start CPR) which tells me that he had a pulse and was breathing when they placed him in the ambulance. Floyd died at the hospital, not on the street.

So again, how did the officer’s kill Floyd? The other officers were not tasked with monitoring Floyd; their jobs were crowd control. You had a very vocal group of people who had gathered around the scene and needed to be kept back. It is tragic that Floyd died. It is more tragic that the press has chosen to continue with their “white police officers murdering innocent blacks who were just minding their own business” campaign as it results in the riots we are experiencing now!

Yer the only one quoting the death count, Blathy..

By definition, the sick fuck is you..

Still waiting for your FACTS that show cops "world wide" have been told not to use the knee to the neck restraint..

But hay... You want to make a wager on November??? I'll be happy to take your dignity away, just like I am taking JM's... :D

You are truly a legend in your own mind if you think you can take away anyone's dignity. The dignity in play here is your's - you're giving away your dignity by trolling not to persuade but rather to try to annoy people. I'd be happy to wager but I'd never expect you to pay up.