But the FACTS are clear..

Dumbocrats caved....

That's all their is too it...

Even CW concedes I am factually accurate.. :D

He's got three weeks to try to convince enough of his people to give in over DACA or he's facing another #trumpshutdown.

Let the games begin.

Yes, sir... and while the sheeple are yucking it up:

* Voters just saw that Washington controlled by Republicans is totally dysfunctional.

* CHIP is no longer a bargaining tool and now extended for 6 years.

* Trump and many Republicans claim to support the Dreamers while others emphatically do not, and they have "promises" to bring a bill to the Senate floor in 3...2...1. Hold McConnell accountable and let the votes fly.

* The ball then lands in Orange Jell-O's court where he can no longer sit shaking on the sidelines on the third floor of the White House mumbling about a "bill of love" while President Kelly and/or Miller overrule him.

Schumer is playing the long game.

They should offer a clean bill in both Houses and send it to the White House using registered mail every single week day to remind them what they need to do.

McConnell must have been desperate to give up the Chip kids he was holding hostage and put his neck in the DACA noose.

Or is he just going to try to stiff the American tax payer?

He's got three weeks to try to convince enough of his people to give in over DACA or he's facing another #trumpshutdown.

Let the games begin.

NOW we know why Captain Lorca is such a bad ass!!!!

:D

Press secretary Sarah Sanders says West Virginia Sen. Joe Manchin and Alabama Sen. Doug Jones are meeting with the president to discuss the legislative path forward after the three-day government shutdown is ended.

Looks like Senator Doug Jones is a Trumper!!! :D

This just keeps getting better and better.. :D

Bullshit... PROVE it..

I did..

Dems give up shutdown fight

Senate Democrats relinquished on the government shutdown Monday, agreeing to vote to reopen the government but insisting they’ll keep fighting for illegal immigrant “Dreamers” over the next weeks, with another shutdown deadline looming Feb. 8.

BBWWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Dumbocrats caved!!!! :D

Yep.. yep... yep... :D

Bullshit... PROVE it..

You can't because you are full of shit..

Whatever you got to say to distract yerselves from the fact that the DUMBOCRATS CAVED!!!!

Score another point for President Trump!! :D

Comey hasn't gone away; he was ready for Trump, and if anyone thinks that firing Mueller is going to make the investigation go away, they're simply deluding themselves like Dumb Donald did when he fired Comey. Duh. :)

The vote to end the filibuster was 81-18, clearing the way for passage of the stopgap spending bill.
https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2018/jan/22/dems-give-shutdown-fight/

Not only do Dems concede they were at fault for the shutdown, they can't even hold it together..

They fold like a cheap chair.. :D

This ALMOST erases the disappointment of the Jaguars loss...

:D

BBWWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

There's yer Dumbocrats... :D

As the third day of the shutdown dawned, liberal advocates and immigration groups fired off a joint statement blasting as "unacceptable" Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell's (R-Ky.) offer to merely hold a vote on immigration — with no promises for action from the House or White House — in exchange for Democratic votes to reopen the government. But three hours later, Democratic senators agreed to just those terms — sparking anger on the left.

BBBBWWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHA

Dumbocrats cave!!!!!

Who said I didn't?

YOU did when you never condemned Odumbo for his slights against Israel..

NOT TRUE. I have a problem with BOTH of them offending allies.

Bullshit... PROVE it..

Show me where you condemned Odumbo as you condemn Trump..

You can't because you are full of shit..

Republicans demanding the release of the memo that they created...

Yep. Devin Nunes found yet another something shocking I tell you... Episode 4. How many times does Nunes have to come up with something shocking that's going to bring it all to a screeching halt that actually doesn't before the sheeple come to the realization that Devin Nunes is an ignorant tool? :)

Mueller
Ain't
Going
Anywhere

Joe Biden would be the perfect antidote to the Trump era.

I agree 100%. In fact, I cannot think of a person alive who is more qualified than Joe Biden to lead this nation; he has no equal in that regard. :)

"Funny how you didn't have a problem with Odumbo offending Israel.."

Who said I didn't? But way to go to cherry pick once again. You pick out the ONE ally Obama had trouble with, while ignoring the good relations with ALL the other allies.

"You see, THIS is why it's IMPOSSIBLE for anyone to take what you say seriously.."

Really Michale, you need to stop talking about YOURSELF.

"You have a problem with Trump allegedly offending allies..

Yet, you have NO PROBLEM with Odumbo offending allies.."

NOT TRUE. I have a problem with BOTH of them offending allies. It's just that Trump has been so much BETTER at offending so many MORE allies than Obama EVER DID.

"You DON'T CARE about offending allies.."

NOT TRUE. READ 114 ABOVE.

"You just don't like it when President Trump does it, but you LOVE it when Odumbo did it..

Hypocrisy..."

Again, please stop talking about YOURSELF. :-)

https://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/common-cause-hush-money-violates-election-law

Funny how you didn't have a problem with Odumbo offending Israel..

You see, THIS is why it's IMPOSSIBLE for anyone to take what you say seriously..

It's ALL solely based on Party bigotry..

You have a problem with Trump allegedly offending allies..

Yet, you have NO PROBLEM with Odumbo offending allies..

You DON'T CARE about offending allies..

You just don't like it when President Trump does it, but you LOVE it when Odumbo did it..

Hypocrisy...

Actually, that Mueller Is Toast prediction #2..

By why bother with FACTS, eh :D

WHOLEHEARTED 100% AGREEMENT! Well said!

(Perhaps you should frame that response and hang it on your wall, because it ain't something ever likely to be seen again on a left-of-center forum.)

I probably should not have said that thing about it "not bothering me". The "America first" is what doesn't bother me, but Trump is such an incompetent ass, he can't even enunciate something with which I do agree, without letting his utter incompetence overwhelm it.

A more articulate way of what I was trying to say in [90].

Thanks.

"Re the negative worldwide opinion of U.S. leadership, etc.

Admittedly, Trump, by his very nature and personality, will never gain the approval of a single foreigner, but that bothers me not in the least."

Actually it should bother both you and every American a great deal. The U.S. Can NEVER get anything done effectively in the world on a unilateral basis, including ANY military operations. We NEED ALLIES. The more and the more diverse, the better. It will take years, it not decades, to undo the damage Trump is doing diplomatically. Some of it will we probably never get back.

You speak of being respected, not loved. The problem you are failing to see is twofold. 1) Respect is much more than JUST military power, its foundation is a deep reservoir of goodwill, based on years of built up trust, admiration for your culture and behavior, and the principles you articulate and follow, how you conduct and present yourself to the world, etc. and 2) America is losing respect under Trump. The only two nations that we currently have a good relationship with under Trump right now are Israel and Japan. He has insulted or lost the confidence of the American ability to lead and be a force for good in the world of other longtime allies like Australia, Britain, Germany South Korea and Turkey.

When America offends its allies, that has real world consequences. Like when Turkey refused to let the United States use the major military base there during the second Iraq war because of Bush's poor ratings among the domestic Turkish populace.

Australia is already starting to cozy up to China. Heaven help us if Germany starts to look to Russia as an alternative partner to America.

Allies need to be both constantly cultivated and reassured, that America will act not only in America's best interest, but in their's as well, in terms of both security, and PEACE, or they are lost. And it's the PEACE component that a lot of those who push the SECURITY aspect tend to forget.

Our allies get upset when America acts against what seems to be its nature, like if we were to wage in their eyes a war of conquest and not a war for justice. Put another way, it would be the difference between fighting a "good" or "just" war, to preserve freedom or independence, like WWII or the liberation of Kuwait, where we had tons of allies and broad coalitions, or a war that is seen as illegal or immoral, selfish, to grab resources or effect regime change just for change's sake. Vietnam and the second Gulf war might be seen in this light.

Mueller is toast prediction #10559 ... and counting.

Strzok has already been outed as anti-Trump, leading to his dismissal from the probe, and his past communications with Page showed a potential Justice Department bias towards Hillary Clinton. The fact that now nearly half a year’s worth of text messages between Strzok and Page during the time leading up to Robert Mueller‘s appointment as Special Counsel weren’t preserved by the Justice Department will surely fuel motions from Team Trump’s lawyers against the investigation.
https://lawandcrime.com/high-profile/lost-fbi-texts-could-form-basis-for-motion-to-dismiss-in-trump-team-fight-against-russia-probe/

One way or another, Mueller is gonna be shut down. :D

Ya'all are shitting yer pants that the memo will be released and the American People will learn how bad Odumbo and the Dumbocrats have scrooed the pooch...

Ya'all are PETRIFIED... :D

Exactly.. It wasn't created by "the Republicans"...

Thank you for proving my point..

The Nunes Memo is a hatchet job on our top cop agency

How do YOU know??

You see my point??

If it's against the Democrats, it's automatically a "hatchet job"...

You have NO facts... Just hysterical Bigotry.. :D

And we have a winner for the "Republican with Least Self Awareness of the Day" award - congrats Michale, you've broken 45's 365-day winning streak!

Factually not accurate..

Wrong.

"The full House can now see classified intelligence usually reserved for only the handful of lawmakers with the highest security clearance. That access comes after the intelligence panel voted along party lines to let all members read in a classified setting the four-page summary of the Nunes investigation into the FBI and Justice Department's use of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act, or FISA."

They call it the "Nunes memo" because it was written by Nunes.

Source: http://www.cnn.com/2018/01/19/politics/devin-nunes-memo-conservatives-demand-release/index.html

Just pointing out once again, how ya'all dispute or ignore the polls that don't say what you want to hear..

Michale 3 hours later: Polls taken ... [show something Michale wanted to hear]

I'd give you a recipe for Humble Pie Michale, but since a key ingredient is "self-awareness" there isn't any point.

The day for Leftist MSM ironies.. :D

Factually not accurate..

But since when have ya'all let FACTS get in the way of a good hysterical rant???

If releasing the House Intelligence Committee memo is not any big deal, why are Democrats fighting tooth and nail to prevent it's release???

White House Press Secretary Sarah Sanders said, "this is the behavior of obstructionist losers, not legislators."
http://www.cnn.com/2018/01/21/opinions/government-shutdown-opinion-stewart/index.html

From CNN of all places.. :D

Who would have thunked it...

GOP bouncing back in 2018 polls after tax cuts

Congressional Republicans have seen a bounce in generic polling against Democrats after passing tax cuts last month. A new CNN poll tightened the margin to 5 points — with Democrats at 49% and Republicans at 44%. The same poll showed Democrats leading by 18 points last month.
https://www.axios.com/after-tax-cut-congressional-gop-bouncing-back-1516546707-5e6390d5-9467-4c05-859c-47397258d412.html

Ya'all have complete faith in THAT poll, right?? :D

You guys are so funny.. :D

Yep.. yep... Yep...

Until one can address the problem (and make no mistake, it IS a problem) equally, said one is PART of the problem and not part of the solution...

End all filibusters...

This site needs no more of your constant vulgarity and endless disrespect toward your fellow commenters..

When will you address the constant vulgarity and endless disrespect that our "fellow commenters" towards us???

Until you can address that equally, yer just spittin' into the wind... :D

Better luck, next year, Michale.

It will be almost as much fun watching the Patriots lose the big one ...

Yea, that was thoroughly depressing... Going into the half, I really thought we had it sewn up...

Ahhhh, but *I* was never making any Mueller's Toast statements, now was I?? :D

Unlike ya'll, with ya'all HUNDREDS of THOUSANDS Trump Is Toast statements, eh? :D

Oh and that memo you cited? I would not count too heavily on Republicans being able to make something out of something made up by their own Republican staffers....

Of course, you would say that. And, of course, you will be wrong just like ALL of the other times you have been wrong with ALL things President Trump.. :D

The hashtag #ReleaseTheMemo, created after outraged Republican lawmakers exposed the existence of a top secret memo detailing serious surveillance abuse by top officials in the Obama administration, has paid off.

Ya'all are starting to sweat, I can tell. :D

#SchumerShutdown

OK, done...

Neil,

Just as I predicted - recent Gallup poll on World leadership - U.S. plummets under 45's lack of leadership ability:

It's SO cute that you still listen to polls.. But it's very telling that you only listen to polls that say what you want to hear.. :D

Joe Biden would be the perfect antidote to the Trump era.

I've found a contempt for people who lean right in the U.S. to denigrate "soft power", however if you look at the international issues that the U.S. wants to exert leverage, the vast, vast majority require soft power. It is useful to have a "big stick" however one of the problems with a "big stick" is that it is more valuable as an unspoken threat than in actual usage.

For example, when we went into Iraq, after openly signaling that we identified N. Korea and Iran as equal partners in the "Axis of Evil" the use of "hard power" was a double disaster.

Firstly, Iran and N. Korea came to the conclusion that the U.S. would arbitrarily invade, overturn, and ultimately kill the leaders of those countries. Thus they needed a deterrent, and there is a fairly simple deterrent (from a scientific and engineering perspective) in nuclear weapons, thus they fired up aggressive nuclear programs.

Secondly we demonstrated that we had no long term plan to win the long war and got bogged down in nation building, with disastrous results. This had the effect of souring a lot of the U.S. public on major military adventures, in effect diminishing the size of the "big stick".

We needed a couple of decades to build up the concern in the rest of the World that the US MIC would need another war to get the money flowing again, coupled with the American public forgetting how badly the last adventure went. In the interim, we also needed to build up a sophisticated, intelligent, effective diplomatic corps.

The current clown in the White House has decimated American power for decades with his antics - the survey I quoted reflects that - nobody thinks we are an effective player any longer, and a new resident in the White House in 2020 won't be able to turn things around for a long time.

The impact of this is mostly hidden, as the value of soft power is necessarily something that you don't brag about, otherwise it evaporates.

This seems like a lesson that most of America cannot grasp because most Americans have little understanding of international interactions and as the "big boy on the block" they have never had to thread the soft power needle that small countries such as Holland, Colombia, Vietnam or Botswana need to as that is all they have.

So Pew Research define middle class which is two-thirds to two times the national median income for your household size.

For a 4 person household that would be $47k to $141k.

This definition is going to shatter some illusions in Happy Valley, CA.

Yeah, OK, I suppose responding in kind IS "juvenile", but I'm just a kid (at heart, anyway).

And what is it to criticize me for only responding in kind, without a mention of the other blogger having initiated the insults? Is that "juvenile", or just simply unfair/unreasonable?

To put it in your vernacular... Yet another Trump is toast statement. Mueller's investigation was supposed to be gone by Thanksgiving, then by the end of the year... and guess what, it will still be going come this summer.

It will be going for years to come; there are hundreds to prosecute. Buckle up. :)

Re the negative worldwide opinion of U.S. leadership, etc.

If foreigners were allowed to vote, NO Rep/Con would EVER be elected pres of the U.S. Admittedly, Trump, by his very nature and personality, will never gain the approval of a single foreigner, but that bothers me not in the least.

If the U.S. were to pursue whatever course of international conduct might be required to gain the love or even the approval of foreigners, it would be disaster for Americans. I couldn't care less if they love us, but I would like them to respect us, and unfortunately, with Trump as pres, we ain't even gonna get that, but he wont last long, so there's hope for the future.

"It is a mystery to me what class is in the U.S. - it was far easier in the U.K., you just listened to their accent and word usage."

Actually it is really pretty easy if you just keep this in mind... Unless you KNOW you live:

A.) In a trailer park or

B.) In a housing project or neighborhood war zone or

C.) like one of the ladies on "Real Housewives" then

You ARE Middle Class in America.

"Mueller's investigation is already gone.."

To put it in your vernacular... Yet another Trump is toast statement. Mueller's investigation was supposed to be gone by Thanksgiving, then by the end of the year... and guess what, it will still be going come this summer.

Oh and that memo you cited? I would not count too heavily on Republicans being able to make something out of something made up by their own Republican staffers....

Beg pardon, I NEVER initiate "vulgarity and endless disrespect", but I do sometimes respond in kind.

Go read Chaszzz's [62], (the first time I ever heard of or from him/her/it) where he/she/it called me a "sexist asshole".

Am I note entitled to respond in kind???

It will be almost as much fun watching the Patriots lose the big one ...

*ROTFLMAO*

Because CRS crosses the line, of course.

JAGS ARE GONNA WIN!!!! :D

Excellent!

This site needs no more of your constant vulgarity and endless disrespect toward your fellow commenters.

Please cease and desist or seek another platform more conducive to your style.

Just as I predicted - recent Gallup poll on World leadership - U.S. plummets under 45's lack of leadership ability:

"Germany is now seen as a global leader by many more people (41% of the sample), with China in second place on 31%. Russia has 27% approval for its global role according to the poll."

“This year marks a significant change in our trends,” wrote Gallup’s managing partner, Jon Clifton. “Only 30% of the world, on average, approves of the job performance of the US’s leadership, down from 48% in 2016. In fact, more people now disapprove of US leadership than approve. This historic low puts the US’s leadership approval rating on par with China’s and sets a new bar for disapproval.”

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/jan/18/us-leadership-world-confidence-poll

Sad.

Or shithouse.. Whichever you prefer..

And that's speaking *AS* a native Californian...

It WAS down 92% in the aftermath of the California Border Wall..

Then the morons in the California (so-called) leadership issued a "YA'ALL COME" to thieves and murderers and drug dealers and rapists and now California is a shithole...

Or shithouse.. Whichever you prefer..

Prior to hearing your blather, I never even knew it was possible to eject flatulence orally. Most people fart out their asses, but it appears you have developed a unique talent in that regard.

I seriously question any statistic that says immigration (across the Mex- U.S border) is "Down 92% in CA". And if in the unlikely case that it happens to actually BE true, the only possible explanation would have to be that the place is already wall-to-wall Hispanics, and there simply ain't room to cram another single one in, right?

Says the guy who backed the luser Hillary Clinton.. :D

In order to get a middle class, you have to divide your group THREE ways, not two ways.

*LOL* "Mongolese" math.

Troll harder. :)

This one's for you.. :D

https://youtu.be/l59ItK6d-wQ

Funny... I am trying to find all ya'all's comments about VP Biden attending Davos... Can't seem to locate a single comment condemning that...

OK, OK, lemme help ya out..

"Well... That's different..."
-Lame Weigantian Response

"Yer Welcome"
-Maui, MOANA

:D

Apparently, being an asshole is funny to everyone else.. :D

"Lighten up, Francis"
-Sgt Hulka, STRIPES

:D

Well, by all means, don't let that stop you from blathering on as usual about topics you don't actually know much about.

Come now.. The entire comment section is made up of "blather" from people who don't know what they are talking about..

Why shouldn't CRS be allowed to partake???

Sure. Being a sexist asshole - it's funny to you! Obviously! Got it.

The single most talented or maybe 'gifted' mathematician I ever met was the women professor why taught my Trig class in college.

Cool story, bro. And was the single most talented or maybe 'gifted' automotive engineer you ever met the person who taught you how to pump gas for your car?

(No doubt she was a good teacher. But here's an example of the sort of thing actual mathematicians think about. It ain't "Trig".)

PS I am NOT gifted in math.

Well, by all means, don't let that stop you from blathering on as usual about topics you don't actually know much about. Your uninformed gut feelings are really important, and we need to listen to them!

He who laughs last laughs best..

A year into the Trump presidency, Obama’s legacy is taking a beating.
http://dailycaller.com/2018/01/20/donald-trump-undoing-barack-obama-legacy/

That's the BEST accomplishment of President Trump to date..

Erasing the stain of Odumbo's administration on this country...

Merkel, often dubbed the world's most powerful woman, has been largely absent from the global stage as the domestic drama has played out, and she is increasingly described by commentators as entering the twilight of her rule.
https://www.yahoo.com/news/germanys-spd-nothing-vote-merkel-alliance-022534739.html

Looks like your new "leader of the free world" is on her way out! :D

Oh, see also your comment [16]. Shoe's on the other foot... anything the GOP does is sweetness and light, right?

You know me well enough to know that I really don't believe that..

As far as I am concerned, both Party's suck.. But the GOP sucks while still caring about their country. Democrats suck AND hate their country...

OK, I will give credit for Trump not going. He realized (or had it explained to him) that hobnobbing with $50K-per-plate crowd would be bad optics when the government is shut down. Heck, I'll even give him credit if he cancels his trip to Davos, to hobnob with the world's 1%, for the same reason (bad optics).

Happy?

Of course.. But it doesn't change my opinion much. You are the exception that emphasizes the rule.. :D

Being stoopid enough to think that a bazillion dollar wall will stop illegal immigration is even several orders of magnitude stoopider than not knowing how long the human gestation period is.

And yet, when California put up it's border wall, illegal immigration was cut by 92% in California..

So, on the one hand, we have your opinion...

And on the other hand, we have FACTs that prove your opinion is wrong...

Hmmmmm... Tough call. :D

As with most persons of the female persuasion, you appear to be mathematically challenged.

Ooooooo yer gonna burn for that one!!! :D hehehehehehe

In Victoria's case, it's not because she's a girl.. It's because she's...well... Victoria... :D

Point to President Trump...

That's all good and I know where you're coming from. We just come at the question of taxation from different ideological positions. I don't actually intentionally advocate for any specific level of taxation for any particular group, I just get tired of hearing the liberal shibboleth "Tax cuts for the rich" invariably used to condemn ALL tax cuts.

If you can tolerate a little bit of knit-picking, avoid that trite phrase "I could care less . . ", which terminology actually conveys the exact opposite of what you're intending to convey.

That is pretty close to the argument I've been hearing from Repubilcans all day. OK, yours was a little more direct, but the same sentiment. So where is your denunciation of this spin? Hmmm?

Heh. Two can play at this game.

Oh, see also your comment [16]. Shoe's on the other foot... anything the GOP does is sweetness and light, right?

[23] -

OK, I will give credit for Trump not going. He realized (or had it explained to him) that hobnobbing with $50K-per-plate crowd would be bad optics when the government is shut down. Heck, I'll even give him credit if he cancels his trip to Davos, to hobnob with the world's 1%, for the same reason (bad optics).

Happy?

TheStig [27] -

Well, thank you for the kind words!

:-)

Don Harris [30] -

Nice! Here's a trip down memory lane for you (way back to FTP [85]) --

http://www.chrisweigant.com/2009/07/10/friday-talking-points-85-roll-up-see-the-show/

:-)

neilm [47] -

Thank you for reminding me -- there's another dandy way to cut taxes at the bottom. Cut the payroll tax rate, and at the same time (to pay for it) scrap the cap on earnings, so that every earner pays the same flat tax rate. Forgot that one!

C. R. Stucki [48] -

Don't most people looking at stats on income cut things into quintiles? So you get "the top fifth" and "the bottom fifth," etc.? That's how I usually see things presented....

C. R. Stucki [52] -

In last week's "Victora" (think that's what it's called -- the PBS/British series), Albert met with Charles Babbage and a woman mathemetician named "Lady Lovelace". She's considered the "first computer programmer" in fact:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ada_Lovelace

I'm not entering the gender argument, here, just wanted to toss a factoid on the pile that I just recently learned of, that's all...

OK, that's it for now. Gotta go watch SNL...

Be nice, everyone...

Heh.

-CW

Once again, if you start with different goals you see different paths to get there. I could care less about "all the taxes collected." Period. It's a meaningless statistic for the goal I would set: reduce taxes on the middle class (which I would define as making less than $150K per year, personally). Whether that reduced the overall taxes paid to the government much or not is immaterial to achieving that goal. Which, as I pointed out, isn't all that hard to accomplish.

Or I could even start from a different place. How about "since SCOTUS says corporations are people, then let's equalize their treatment by the tax code." So let's let workers write off all interest and bank charges they pay (credit cards, checking, whatever), for example. And when they buy lunch in the middle of a workday, allow them to write off that cost as well. If they commute to work, allow them to write off a cost-per-mile (not sure what the official rate is up to, 50 cents a mile?) of doing so with their own car. How's that for providing tax relief without giving any of it (any more than is currently given, I should say) to Wall Street?

It ain't rocket science. But you have to start from a different place, have a different goal, and take a different path, that's all. I mean, I'm not disputing your view (or your facts) at all, but I am saying there are different ways to "cut taxes" that don't give away the store, that's all.

-CW

This is a long discussion. The average for women could be higher than for men, however the standard deviation could be larger for men, and thus there are more extremes in men than in women - I'm not saying this is the case, although I've seen some preliminary work that supports this (I'll need to dig out some research).

I've got to be social tonight - I'll come back to this.

Re Math ability and genetics.

How can you possibly deny that genetics isn't close to 100% in math talent? Obviously I'm mostly just yanking Kicks chain over the "female persuasion" thing. The single most talented or maybe 'gifted' mathematician I ever met was the women professor why taught my Trig class in college. But I doubt there's ever been a real mathematician in all of history who wasn't born with the talent or at least the aptitude.

And in spite of the fact that it's seriously politically incorrect to mention the fact, it's still undeniably true that math talent is far more common in men than in women, and that's gotta be genetics, right?

PS I am NOT gifted in math. I muddled clear through a math minor in college, (B's and C's) but it was not because I had any special talent for it.

Yeah, you've nailed the weird habit of all Americans to consider themselves 'middle class'. I think the Brit thing obviously has its roots in the 'lords, ladies, common folks', etc. heritage from the days of nobility, royalty, etc. (We actually fought a war to keep from having to deal with that kind of thing, remember?)

Re Me and Kick, You've got the right idea, but the wrong proportions - light on the ignorant bigotry, and HEAVY on the trolling!!

Of COURSE I'm focused on income taxes, and even on only FED income taxes, because that's the only thing the bill we're arguing about is concerned with. Far as I'm aware, congress is not even discussing modifying the SS taxes, or any other payroll taxes.

You are absolutely correct about payroll taxes, and if you wish to expand the discussion to TOTAL taxation, you would need to throw in state income taxes, state and local sales taxes, property taxes, etc, most all of which are disproportionately paid by lower income earners, but that's not the bill we've been arguing the merits of for these many weeks, right? Far as I know, the IRS doesn't even concern itself with all those other taxes, so their stats naturally only reference the fed INCOME TAX.

In fact, just about everybody I know considers themselves middle class in the U.S. and always seems to have, as far as I can determine.

I have a friend who earns close to a seven figure salary who is convinced he is solidly middle class and a relative who, while wealthy today, grew up in what I would call poverty in the 1960s on the East Coast, and also considers herself
middle class and always has.

It is a mystery to me what class is in the U.S. - it was far easier in the U.K., you just listened to their accent and word usage.

It is also a mystery why somebody could be so dumb as to attribute an ability in basic math to genetics - sadly I'll put it down to ignorant bigotry with a dash of trolling.

As with most persons of the female persuasion, you appear to be mathematically challenged.

When you divide earners/taxpayers 50 - 50, as does the IRS with the statistic I quoted, you do not HAVE a "middle class", you have an 'upper and a lower', or maybe a 'rich' and a 'poor', but no "middle"

In order to get a middle class, you have to divide your group THREE ways, not two ways.

If you do decide to divide three ways, then indeed, not just "many" of those in the IRS system (50% of earners)" are in the middle class, in actuality MOST of the top 50% are in the middle class, simply because there are so many of them.

when the bottom 50% of the earners pay only 2.8% of all the tax collected

I assume you are using the IRS's 2016 update of 2014 taxes as your source.

If so, are you aware that this only focused on income taxes (about 25% of the total taxes collected) and does not include the far less progressive payroll taxes (20% of the total)?

Or are you using another source, and if so, can you list it please?

Yeah, maybe even more than one "stoopid" thing in my life, but all stoopids are not created equal. Being stoopid enough to think that a bazillion dollar wall will stop illegal immigration is even several orders of magnitude stoopider than not knowing how long the human gestation period is.

I am SURE there would be people out there who would say, "Jeezus, that CRS is simply stoopid..."

For the record, CRS, I am not singling you out..

I would imagine anyone here, myself included, would look and/or appear stoopid at one time or another if our every utterance, our every moment was an open book broadcast to the world..

ESPECIALLY when you consider that 90% of the Leftist Media reports of President Trump are negative...