Hokay... :D

398

Good point.

[2] -

Even better point. It's a symbiotic relationship, that's for sure...

[3] -

OK, "peak irony" -- I'm going to have to remember who coined that, because I do see myself using it on a regular basis, next year.

:-)

John From Censornati [5] -

Amen to that. I mean, I have a soft spot in my heart for Mitt's dad George (for being the "father of the Rambler" and the head of AMC), I have no such positive feelings towards Mitt. Especially after seeing him grovel in hopes of getting SofS.

michale [6] -

OK, on another comment to another article (I'm kind of answering column dates randomly, I fully admit) you stated this in shorthand form. So now I have to admit you have laid out your full case for "Putin helped Hillary"... that's not to say I believe it (I don't) but I do now totally understand where you're coming from. So I retract my former comment asking you for details, as you seem to have laid them all out here.

altohone [8] -

Got a link? I apologize if the spam filter ate your link, but I'd like to read that story, I admit...

OK, that's it for this thread, for now...

-CW

Glad to see Rand Paul doing the right thing.

Romney got what he deserved... though he actually deserves even more.

A

I wish it was only political irony (though hypocrisy may be the better word) at play here.

The truth is that truth and fact are being discarded by too many on both sides in a manner that is quite dangerous.

See my comment to CW... and check out that article at TI too.

A

"The idea that Donald Trump can overrule the consensus of 17 federal intelligence agencies because he doesn't believe what they are saying has rather frightening implications for American foreign policy, that's for sure. So knowing that congressional Republicans will occasionally ignore Trump's post-fact pronouncements and listen to the experts"

When I have to agree with the troll (parts of comment 6), and you are agreeing with Mitch McConnell, you should double check your sources.

I strongly recommend-
"Here's the public information that Russia hacked the DNC- It's not enough"
by Sam Biddle
Currently the lead story at The Intercept

It's a non-partisan, far from pro-Putin, fact based analysis of what is publicly known about the hacking... and he even trashes Assange a bit so you and all the others who think Americans shouldn't know certain things will like it... but it also happens to come to the same conclusion as Trump.

It also makes it rather plain that there are "frightening implications for American foreign policy" due to all the people (like you) assuming facts not in evidence.

What you are saying might be true, but it might not.
Your blaming of Russia for the hacking is not currently factual.

And you may be inadvertently serving an agenda that violates your own beliefs.

A

If it's Trump against the GOP...

Who ya'all gonna root for??

"Oh no, I've gone cross-eyed.."
-Austin Powers

:D

301

Let's be clear here.. There is no consensus of 17 intelligence agencies.. Even if there were, the ONLY consensus that matters is the Department Of National Intelligence, as it oversees all the other agencies..

And the DNI has stated for the record, that evidence that condemns Russia is far from conclusive..

The idea that Russia would hack our elections to put Trump is utterly ludicrous when one looks objectively at the issue..

1. It's inarguable to say that Putin has enjoyed nearly free reign under Obama... Putin has time and again pushed his agenda with little or no repercussions from the United States.. So, it stands to reason that Russia would want Obama 3.0 in the White House. Which means Hillary Clinton...

2. Russian Intelligence knows the American psyche better than most Americans.. If Russia actually DID want Trump in the White House, they would have supported Hillary thru their "covert hack" of the US Election which would have turned Americans even MORE against Hillary and ensure a Trump win...

3. Russian Intelligence is smarter than this.. The fingerprints left on this "hack" is amateur hour.. Or a deliberate plant..

4. The CIA has been the Left's scapegoat on everything bad and evil in this world for the last 5 decades.. NOW all of the sudden, the CIA is the golden child?? The CIA didn't know the Berlin Wall was coming down until mortar started hitting them on the head... The CIA didn't know that Russia was going to take The Crimea until the Russian Flag flew over The Crimean town hall.. NOW the CIA is all knowing???

5. Within a few days of the election, the White House certified that the Election was free from outside interference and influence...

6. It's funny how the Russian menace became so menacing after other attempts to derail Trump's presidency failed. We didn't hear much about the so called Russian "support" of Trump during the recount phase... We didn't hear much about the so called Russian "support" of Trump during the Attack The Electors phase.. Only after those had failed, all of the sudden, it's RUSSIA STOLE THE ELECTION FOR TRUMP!!!

7. Washington Post is at the forefront of this Anti-Russian campaign.. 'Nuff said about THAT...

8. "Russia could be the lever that Democrats use again and again for the next few years to pound Republicans and Trump as unAmerican.

Maybe we aren't in a post-factual World. Maybe we are in a peak-irony era."
-Neil

:D 'nuff said about that...

To sum up...

Was there Russian hacks?? It's possible. Some circumstantial evidence supports that conclusion.. But the goal was likely to sow general distrust in our democratic process as opposed to supporting a specific candidate. Russian Intelligence knows Americans and knows that any overt "covert" support of a candidate would turn the American people AGAINST that candidate... So, it stands to reason that if Russia wanted Trump, it's overt "covert" support would be in favor of Hillary..

Did Russia want Trump as POTUS over Hillary?? Highly doubtful.. Putin isn't going to base the covert actions of his intelligence agencies on who Putin does and does not like. Putin will base the covert actions of his intelligence agencies on what will best serve his agenda. And it's clear from the last 8 years that having Obama 3.0 in the White House would serve his agenda a LOT more than having Trump in the White House..

300

I don't think there was anything smart about Rmoney participating in any way with a charade that was designed to humiliate him. It's just another example of how shallow and shameless he is and how lucky we are without him.

It's unlikely that he doesn't believe that. He says he doesn't believe it, but that could easily be interpreted as self-serving.

The irony of this possibility absolutely astounds me. Particularly after Obama laughed at Romney in 2012 for using Russia as a boogeyman.

Maybe we aren't in a post-factual World. Maybe we are in a peak-irony era.

OK, that came out wrong. Blame a nice evening at the 1/2 price Tuesday night Vietnamese restaurant with friends. Let me try again.

Trump needs Congress to rubber stamp what he wants and Congress need Trump to rubber stamp what they want.

Then the venality bit ;)

I'm not 100% sure I trust McConnell on this yet. He could well be using Senate hearings as a way to punt this 5 months into the future to defang the whole thing.

The Republicans need Trump to sign legislation and Trump needs Congress to give them everything they have wanted for eight years.

The venality of politicians is not to be underestimated.