Comments on: Friday Talking Points [392] -- Don't Panic!

By: Michale

Michale — Thu, 26 May 2016 09:50:49 +0000

Kirk points out that "evil" {Republicans} fought for personal gain, while "good" {Democrats} fought when it became necessary to save others.

And, if I may be a bit nit-picky, in that episode EVIL fought for POWER...

As such, there is really no difference in the motivations of Democrats and Republicans.

Both fight for POWER...

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Thu, 26 May 2016 08:21:14 +0000

Kirk points out that "evil" {Republicans} fought for personal gain, while "good" {Democrats} fought when it became necessary to save others. If we were talking motivations, then you would have a point... But we're not, so you don't.. :D However, since you bring it up, let's explore it.. What you seem to be saying here is that the Ends Justifies The Means... That the exact same evil that Evil uses is perfectly acceptable in the pursuit of good.. Do you agree with that meme??? Because, if you do, we should probably move this conversation forward because I have DOOZIES of comments.. :D wow, that's twice this week michale has been hoisted by his own picard :) Oh bite me! :D Michale

By: nypoet22

nypoet22 — Wed, 25 May 2016 22:02:39 +0000

@JM,

wow, that's twice this week michale has been hoisted by his own picard

:)
JL

By: John M

John M — Wed, 25 May 2016 21:30:21 +0000

Michale wrote:

"Your {Democrats} and your {Republicans} use the same methods to achieve the same goals."
-Yarnek/General George Washington , STAR TREK

You forgot the rest of that scene Michale:

Kirk points out that "evil" {Republicans} fought for personal gain, while "good" {Democrats} fought when it became necessary to save others.

Just to clear things up. :-D

By: Michale

Michale — Wed, 25 May 2016 11:15:46 +0000

Thank you :-) I'm just a week out of hospital and still feeling very delicate but glad to be here. :D

Take care of yourself..

Michale

By: Mopshell

Mopshell — Wed, 25 May 2016 10:49:08 +0000

Michale [101] -

Glad ta see ya!!! :D

Thank you :-) I'm just a week out of hospital and still feeling very delicate but glad to be here. :D

By: Michale

Michale — Tue, 24 May 2016 18:41:38 +0000

It's that time of the year again...

Hurricane Season starts on 1 June and Michale starts his 6-month vigil searching for the end of the world... :D

"It would be if you didn't harbor this morbid desire to face the end of the world"
-Morgan Freeman, OUTBREAK

Interesting factoid.. There hasn't been a strike of a major hurricane on US soil in over a decade....

Funny, iddn't it.. :D

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Tue, 24 May 2016 18:08:33 +0000

it used to. then somewhere along the line, many democrats started to think they were holier than thou and above old-school dirty politics, at which point they all promptly started to lose.

So, you would agree:

"Your {Democrats} and your {Republicans} use the same methods to achieve the same goals."
-Yarnek/General George Washington , STAR TREK

Speaking of Clinton...

I see that Cosby is going to stand trial for sexual assault..

Think we'll ever see Clinton stand trial for HIS sexual crimes??

Michale

By: nypoet22

nypoet22 — Tue, 24 May 2016 17:47:07 +0000

And they say that the Democrat machine does all of this as a matter of course... :D

it used to. then somewhere along the line, many democrats started to think they were holier than thou and above old-school dirty politics, at which point they all promptly started to lose. the clintons are the exception.

By: Michale

Michale — Tue, 24 May 2016 15:16:26 +0000

VINCE FOSTER LIVES!
TRUMP LAUNCHES NEW LINE OF ATTACK
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trump-escalates-attack-on-bill-clinton/2016/05/23/ed109acc-2100-11e6-8690-f14ca9de2972_story.html

I tell ya, it's going to be a massacre... Clinton doesn't stand a chance....

And the great thing is, Trump is only getting started... Imagine what he is going to do to Clinton when Comey's indictment recommendation comes out...

"Twenty years of crawling.. Was bottled up inside him..
He wuddn't holding nothing back, he let 'em have it all...
When Tommy left the barroom, not a Gatlin boy was standing..
He said this one's for Juanita as he watched the last one fall.."
-Kenny Rogers, THE COWARD OF THE COUNTY

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Tue, 24 May 2016 14:55:36 +0000

And they say that the Democrat machine does all of this as a matter of course... :D

But who can believe what THEY say!?? The are Republicans, after all, eh? :D

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Tue, 24 May 2016 14:22:48 +0000

it's a nasty game; the republican machine does all this as a matter of course.

And they say that the Democrat machine does all of this as a matter of course... :D

The facts are somewhere in the middle...

Michale

By: nypoet22

nypoet22 — Tue, 24 May 2016 11:07:27 +0000

Don't bother posting more. I read bunches of them, then read various explanations and refutations before coming to a conclusion. i read numerous refutations, and found them wanting. if you didn't want me to add details, you shouldn't have requested them. at least for the five tactics i mentioned, there is ample evidence that they occurred and inadequate evidence to refute the claims. it's a nasty game; the republican machine does all this as a matter of course. although i don't support it on principle, i do understand that playing by marquess of queensberry rules is a good way to lose elections. JL

By: Michale

Michale — Tue, 24 May 2016 08:47:59 +0000

[120] Thank for your concern for the well-being of Hillary's campaign. Why, yer quite welcome.. :D So things are moving along. What's Hillary doing to help "move things along"?? She has a buttload of culpability in this as well.. Michale

By: Paula

Paula — Mon, 23 May 2016 23:24:38 +0000

[122] I am taking about specific events that occurred on a specific day, period.

Your second link is just the kind of stuff that ended up everywhere because Sanders delegates were complaining all over social media that they were being screwed, when in point of fact they were misunderstanding what was happening. It includes references to the 64 delegates they demanded be seated, 50 of whom weren't even there.

Don't bother posting more. I read bunches of them, then read various explanations and refutations before coming to a conclusion.

By: nypoet22

nypoet22 — Mon, 23 May 2016 22:39:35 +0000

That was from February -- nothing to do with what just happened last week.

february 20 was the date of the nevada caucuses. i consider that relevant.

here's the result from last week:

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2016/05/15/chaos_at_nevada_democratic_convention_dnc_leaders_flee_building_as_sanders_supporters_demand_recount.html

By: Paula

Paula — Mon, 23 May 2016 22:19:57 +0000

[120] Thank for your concern for the well-being of Hillary's campaign.

On that front it appears the DNC has come to agreement about Sanders' representation on the platform committee. From Washington Monthly they quote: Here is the statement from the Sanders campaign:

We believe that we will have the representation on the platform drafting committee to create a Democratic platform that reflects the views of millions of our supporters who want the party to address the needs of working families in this country and not just Wall Street, the drug companies, the fossil fuel industry and other powerful special interests.

So things are moving along.

By: Michale

Michale — Mon, 23 May 2016 22:05:44 +0000

You mean, beating him in a contest?

Does Hillary want Bernie supporters to vote for her in Nov???

That's the question you have to ask yourself..

If she doesn't give a rat's ass about that, then she is free to beat Bernie unmercifully and rub ALL the Bernie supporters noses in it... Add insult to injury with abandon...

But, if she WANTS Bernie's support and if the WANTS Bernie's supporter's support...

Then GRACIOUS is the name of the game...

Michale

By: Paula

Paula — Mon, 23 May 2016 21:56:44 +0000

Michale: "Kicking someone in the balls repeatedly when they're down and then asking them to vote for you??"

You mean, beating him in a contest?

By: Paula

Paula — Mon, 23 May 2016 21:53:32 +0000

[115] What link are you talking about? This one? http://usuncut.com/politics/the-nevada-caucus-is-a-complete-fiasco/

That was from February -- nothing to do with what just happened last week.

I don't know anything about the allegations in that article and am not addressing them in any way.

By: Michale

Michale — Mon, 23 May 2016 21:52:10 +0000

Paula,

Tell ya what...

Let's table this discussion for now...

In a month or two, when ya'all are complaining that Bernie supporters are giving Hillary the finger and supporting Trump, we can revisit the discussion with a heartfelt....

"If only Hillary was gracious back in Nevada..."

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Mon, 23 May 2016 21:48:45 +0000

It's NOT ludicrous... Kicking someone in the balls repeatedly when they're down and then asking them to vote for you?? THAT'S ludicrous.... Because she wants that ego on HER side in a month or two... THAT's why.... Am I wrong??? "You're not wrong" -God :D Michale

By: nypoet22

nypoet22 — Mon, 23 May 2016 21:27:16 +0000

By simply assuming something dirty went down you perpetuate this notion the Hillary campaign or Nevada Dem Party cheated.

i sent you a link to the specifics. if you need me to spell it out then sure:

1. on camera, allowed their own voters to caucus without registering.

2. intentionally mis-counting votes, or "mistakenly" entering votes for clinton that were intended for sanders. too many reports in the same nevada precincts for it to have been an honest mistake.

3. push polling

4. printing inaccurate information about caucus times and locations, handing out accurate information to hillary delegates and inaccurate information to sanders delegates.

5. sanders delegates said they were told not to come and threatened with arrest if they did come to a county convention, unless they changed their vote to clinton.

that's just what i found on short notice. i may perhaps insinuate that those were not the only tricks played by the clinton campaign. why then would i vote for clinton anyway? because i think she'll do a better job as president than either of the other two remaining candidates. i want a president who will do a good job once elected. full stop.

By: Michale

Michale — Mon, 23 May 2016 21:15:44 +0000

Michale: the notion that Hillary needed to be "gracious" and surrender delegates is ludicrous. It's NOT ludicrous... Kicking someone in the balls repeatedly when they're down and then asking them to vote for you?? THAT'S ludicrous.... Why isn't she allowed to win without worrying about Bernie's delicate ego? Because she wants that ego on HER side in a month or two... THAT's why.... Michale

By: Paula

Paula — Mon, 23 May 2016 20:57:27 +0000

[112] Denying WHAT happened? That's my point. Its perfectly possible to fabricate outrages -- repubs do it all day long. Benghazeeeeee!!!! By simply assuming something dirty went down you perpetuate this notion the Hillary campaign or Nevada Dem Party cheated. Oh well. If that's what you want to do, you will. Michale: the notion that Hillary needed to be "gracious" and surrender delegates is ludicrous. If positions were reversed I don't think for one second you'd expect Bernie to surrender delegates to be "gracious". And it would have mattered in the sense that a win would feed Bernie's narrative. Why should Hillary want to do that? Why should she be expected to do that? Why isn't she allowed to win without worrying about Bernie's delicate ego?

By: nypoet22

nypoet22 — Mon, 23 May 2016 20:42:02 +0000

@paula, no, i'm not talking about there being fire where there's smoke, i'm talking about there being fire where there's fire. keep in mind that i'm planning to vote for clinton in the primary regardless, but there's no possible way this stuff was fabricated or sour grapes. it's old-school, full-contact politics. although i'm sure there's plausible deniability by anybody high up, there's no point denying that it happened. JL

By: neilm

neilm — Mon, 23 May 2016 20:36:57 +0000

Obama poll watch:

Last time a party won three times in a row was 1988 - Obama's polls above Reagan's at the same point in the cycle.

http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/president-obamas-poll-support-raises-eyebrows

By: nypoet22

nypoet22 — Mon, 23 May 2016 20:35:59 +0000

What "statistics" are you referring to?? Because I would be VERY wary of ANY statistics that show what's in a person's heart...

nothing to do with a person's heart, just the fact that according to a texas study, 7.4% of registered voters don't have a photo ID that would be accepted under the recent wave of ID legislation. That's almost 11 million LEGAL voters who wouldn't be able to vote. and those individuals are mostly non-drivers, i.e. poor, elderly or disabled, people who might have a disproportionately tough time gathering the proper documentation to get a photo ID - which can be a challenge even for the young, mobile and financially secure.

in comparison, there were a grand total of 2,068 cases of ALLEGED voter fraud in the last presidential election. so, what i mean specifically by statistics is that even if every single allegation of voter fraud proved true, photo ID laws would STILL prevent over 500 times more legal voters than illegal voters. even if you want to nitpick the methodology, the difference is dramatic enough that there's no way it would ever be close. strict photo ID laws for voting will always hurt many, many times more people who are legally entitled to vote.

no matter which party is in charge or which party wins, those laws are just flat wrong - an end-run around the 24th amendment.

the movie i meant was the princess bride.

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/15/6b/64/156b643cdf9db787e140f9d045163e7f.jpg

By: Michale

Michale — Mon, 23 May 2016 20:30:03 +0000

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/donald-trumps-new-attack-ad-896660

It's only going to get worse and worse for Hillary...

Hillary has NEVER campaigned against someone like Trump...

She is bringing shiny beads and shallow flattery to a gun fight...

It's gonna be a massacre...

Can't wait for the debates... :D

By: Michale

Michale — Mon, 23 May 2016 20:18:41 +0000

In point of fact, it looks like Bernie's folks went into the convention planning to hijack it. All this was over 2 delegates -- but whoever got the 2 delegates get's to say they "won" Nevada in a close contest versus "lost". I think Bernie's team wanted the win to bolster their narrative of having the momentum. I don't say Bernie was personally involved in that -- have no idea. But his team set this up and went a little nuts when they didn't prevail. And Hillary could have been gracious and gave them that win, as it would not have made a SINGLE difference in the end result.. THAT says a lot more about Hillary than it does about Bernie supporters.. If Hillary want's Bernie support, then Hillary should have been gracious... The fact that she wasn't is simply going to make it that much harder to prevent Bernie supporters from going with Trump... Hillary has to do her part to unite the Party or else Bernie supporters are MORE than well within their rights to give Clan Clinton the big ol' FRAK YOU!! WE'RE VOTING TRUMP!!! Michale

By: Paula

Paula — Mon, 23 May 2016 17:23:21 +0000

Actually, Clinton won the first round, Bernie won the second round, this was the third round. Sorry.

By: Paula

Paula — Mon, 23 May 2016 16:20:23 +0000

In point of fact, it looks like Bernie's folks went into the convention planning to hijack it. All this was over 2 delegates -- but whoever got the 2 delegates get's to say they "won" Nevada in a close contest versus "lost". I think Bernie's team wanted the win to bolster their narrative of having the momentum. I don't say Bernie was personally involved in that -- have no idea. But his team set this up and went a little nuts when they didn't prevail. The situation parallels what Ted Cruz was doing in caucus states -- it all came down to how many people you had on the spot to twist arms. Bernie's campaign had more people in the first meeting and "won". Clinton's team learned from that and made sure their people showed up at this event. As it turned out, more Clinton people turned out this time than Bernie people. This 64 delegate "robbery" getting thrown around was about 14 people who actually showed up, and 50 names on a list of Bernie delegates who didn't bother to show up. Out of the remaining 14, 8 were rejected by a committee composed of 5 Hillary people and 5 Bernie people. 6 of Clinton's people were similarly rejected.

By: Paula

Paula — Mon, 23 May 2016 15:53:12 +0000

[86] it seems highly likely based on the reports and video clips in the article that there were some dirty tricks being played on hillary's behalf. No. Now you are doing the "no smoke without a fire". C'mon. This is exactly what I object to re: Bernie harvesting years of rightwing slurs.

By: Michale

Michale — Mon, 23 May 2016 15:53:06 +0000

Freddie Gray Arresting Officer Edward Nero Found Not Guilty On All Charges
http://baltimore.cbslocal.com/2016/05/23/freddie-gray-arresting-officer-edward-nero-found-not-guilty-on-all-charges/

And justice is served once again...

More and more, racist city officials are LOSING the battle to sacrifice cops on their racist altar of political correctness...

A welcome development...

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Mon, 23 May 2016 11:35:05 +0000

I have to ask myself what the re-brand of "Bud Light" will be? make america lite again "Together, we can make Hell great again." -Crowley :D heh Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Mon, 23 May 2016 11:16:37 +0000

And ta round out my Round Up...

Donald Trump is the clear choice for pro-Israel voters
http://nypost.com/2016/05/19/donald-trump-is-the-clear-choice-for-pro-israel-voters/

I agree with all of the reasons, except #5.....

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Mon, 23 May 2016 11:07:03 +0000

MS,

Glad ta see ya!!! :D

Trump: "I know it was a bomb. I have my own airplane which is why I know it was a bomb."

That was pretty lame, I grant you. Eye-rolling lame...

Not only do Trump's thought processes defy all logic, the real experts consider the chance of it being a bomb to be miniscule.

Actually, only the politically-correct experts think the chances are small of it being a bomb.

The REAL experts are looking at the evidence and it's likely that some sort of incendiary device was the cause of the crash...

Wreckage and passenger bodies, etc etc show an inundation of smoke immediately prior to the crash...

So, while it might not be a bomb, in the conventional sense, it was definitely an incendiary device of some sort that brought down the plane...

What I find interesting is that ISIS hasn't taken credit for it...

So, something IS afoot....

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Mon, 23 May 2016 11:03:12 +0000

Trump with a united GOP at his back and Independents at his side???

How can he lose??

Conversely..... And more importantly...

And everybody remembers the 1990s, during her husband’s presidency, as the relative good old days, when Mr. Clinton was groping and molesting young women in the White House and Mrs. Clinton was scheming to destroy any of them who complained about it. Oh, and meanwhile, Osama bin Laden was undisturbed, plotting the worst terrorist attack in U.S. history.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/may/19/charles-hurt-shenanigans-of-clintons-husband-will-/?page=all#pagebreak

.... with Bill Clinton at Hillary's side....

How can she win???

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Mon, 23 May 2016 10:56:48 +0000

Say what ya'all want about Trump..

5 very smart things Donald Trump has done since becoming the presumptive GOP nominee
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/05/19/five-very-smart-things-donald-trump-has-done-since-become-the-presumptive-republican-presidential-nominee/

But he is making it clear that he can win a General Election...

Trump with a united GOP at his back and Independents at his side???

How can he lose??

Michale

By: Mopshell

Mopshell — Mon, 23 May 2016 10:53:22 +0000

May 21

Donald Trump is asked about Egypt Air's flight MS804 and its fatal crash into the Mediterranean.

Trump: "I know it was a bomb. I have my own airplane which is why I know it was a bomb."

Not only do Trump's thought processes defy all logic, the real experts consider the chance of it being a bomb to be miniscule.

By: Michale

Michale — Mon, 23 May 2016 10:52:41 +0000

I should start calling this my MONDAY MEDIA ROUNDUP :D

A Hit Job as Transparent as a Bikini
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2016/05/22/a_hit_job_as_transparent_as_a_bikini_130638.html

OHMYGODS!!!!

Trump likes women!!!

Oh the horror!!! Oh the infamy!!!! OH MY GODS, THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!!!

How Trump is allowed to continue to live is beyond me!!!

{/sarcasm}

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Mon, 23 May 2016 10:39:11 +0000

As Hillary Clinton joylessly stumbles her way to the Democratic nomination, calls have increased for Bernie Sanders to either drop out of the race altogether or, at least, to stop fighting so darn hard. We’re told that Bernie should drop out for the good of the party. Bernie should drop out so that Hillary can make her general election “pivot” (which presumably means she can be free of the burden of pretending to be a liberal). Bernie should drop out so that Hillary can focus on Trump. According to this logic, Bernie and his band of loyalists need to get pragmatic, face the music, have a reality check. Hogwash. Doesn’t anyone see what I see? Bernie Sanders is our best chance to beat Donald Trump and to prove to the young voters backing him that the Democratic party actually stands for something.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/krystal-ball/why-bernie-sanders-is-our_b_10064830.html?

Can't argue with the logic...

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Mon, 23 May 2016 10:39:03 +0000

Can't argue with the logic...

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Mon, 23 May 2016 09:55:07 +0000

On another topic...

How corporate America bought Hillary Clinton for $21M
http://nypost.com/2016/05/22/how-corporate-america-bought-hillary-clinton-for-21m/

This is who ya'all want for POTUS???

Between Hillary, her book deal and Bubba, the Clintons have raked in over 50 MILLION dollars in just TWO YEARS from corporate America...

CW has often advocated that politicians should NASCAR their attire with the names of their corporate sponsors...

Hillary would likely need to gain a TON of weight to be able to display all the corporations who have bought and paid for her...

I'm just sayin'....

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Mon, 23 May 2016 09:48:31 +0000

Actually, many, if not all, ARE at no cost... and NONE of the Voter ID laws are written to exclude ANY citizen...

Key word there being CITIZEN

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Mon, 23 May 2016 09:47:15 +0000

Having said all of the afore, let me say this..

What the Nevada Democrat Party did when they disenfranchised Bernie supporters was to protect the integrity of the vote..

If they had nefarious motivations in mind, then that's on them..

But the concept of protecting the integrity of the vote by way of Voter ID is a valid concept...

And it's a valid concept no matter WHAT the vote is for..

Primary, Secondary, General, Class President, VFW Secretary..

Protecting the integrity of the vote is the primary (no pun intended) consideration and is the number one priority...

Because if it's not, voting makes no sense and is useless...

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Mon, 23 May 2016 09:42:16 +0000

GT,

....or to put it into terms of simplicity.

If primary elections were general elections you would have a point (maybe), but they aren't so you don't.

HOISTED BY MY OWN PICARD!!

Well played... :D

If voter id laws were written to be inclusive and not cost or exclude any citizen, you might have a point, but, they aren't so you don't.

Actually, many, if not all, ARE at no cost... and NONE of the Voter ID laws are written to exclude ANY citizen...

So, in this instance, it's you who has no point. :D

As for the cost... Cost does not equal disenfranchise... It costs you gas to drive to the polls to vote.. Does that mean there is an illegal cost to vote??

Of course not... It's an incidental cost only tangentially connected to voting..

So is obtaining an ID...

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Mon, 23 May 2016 09:37:52 +0000

JL, you really must see that film. Did I miss something?? Film??? no, it's a legit motivation, just statistically unsupported and likely to prevent FAR more real votes than fake ones. "There are lies, there are damn lies and then there are statistics" -Mark Twain :D What "statistics" are you referring to?? Because I would be VERY wary of ANY statistics that show what's in a person's heart... that hillary's people did it to bernie's people was dirty and underhanded, definitely full-contact party politics, and i don't support it at all. however, as JM said, intra-party selection processes do not include a constitutionally mandated right to vote, while general elections do. That's semantics.. It's dirty and underhanded and that's that... Having said that, let me say this.. "I'm glad you approve." "I said I understand. I did not say I approve." STAR TREK, A Taste Of Armageddon If that's where you and JM are coming from, then I accept that... Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Mon, 23 May 2016 09:25:37 +0000

I have to ask myself what the re-brand of "Bud Light" will be? Canada? Oh snap... "And the ref takes a point away!!" -Jim Carrey, LIAR LIAR :D

By: neilm

neilm — Mon, 23 May 2016 05:34:14 +0000

ince Butwiper....,err Budwiser, is renaming itself "AMERICA", or for those of us with humor, 'merica. I have to ask myself what the re-brand of "Bud Light" will be? Canada? Sorry, no really, sorry. I mean it, Canada is a great place. I lived there once. Montreal. I promise, I'll never compare Bud Light to Canada again. Really.

By: nypoet22

nypoet22 — Mon, 23 May 2016 02:42:29 +0000

@gt,

it's just temporary.

I have to ask myself what the re-brand of "Bud Light" will be?

make america lite again

By: nypoet22

nypoet22 — Mon, 23 May 2016 02:38:33 +0000

@paula [82],

from tom cahill at u.s. uncut:

According to the latest on-the-ground reports from Democratic caucus-goers in Nevada, the entire process is being described as a “fiasco” where confusion and deception is rampant.

it seems highly likely based on the reports and video clips in the article that there were some dirty tricks being played on hillary's behalf.

http://usuncut.com/politics/the-nevada-caucus-is-a-complete-fiasco/

By: goode trickle

goode trickle — Mon, 23 May 2016 01:24:37 +0000

Now on to things that make you go hmmmmmm....

Since Butwiper....,err Budwiser, is renaming itself "AMERICA", or for those of us with humor, 'merica.

I have to ask myself what the re-brand of "Bud Light" will be?

By: goode trickle

goode trickle — Mon, 23 May 2016 01:17:01 +0000

....or to put it into terms of simplicity.

If primary elections were general elections you would have a point (maybe), but they aren't so you don't.

Or....

If voter id laws were written to be inclusive and not cost or exclude any citizen, you might have a point, but, they aren't so you don't.

By: Paula

Paula — Mon, 23 May 2016 00:30:12 +0000

Also: https://www.ralstonreports.com/blog/sour-grapes-revolution-rocked-paris-hotel

By: Paula

Paula — Mon, 23 May 2016 00:29:35 +0000

[81] JL: "What Hillary did to Bernie's people was dirty..."

What did Hillary's people do that was dirty...you don't support?

I've read several accounts of events now and the accusations don't hold up. What is it you think Hillary's people did?

http://www.politifact.com/nevada/statements/2016/may/18/jeff-weaver/allegations-fraud-and-misconduct-nevada-democratic/

Michale: NOT semantics.

By: nypoet22

nypoet22 — Mon, 23 May 2016 00:17:59 +0000

Insuring the integrity of the vote?? Is that really so inconceivable?? you really must see that film. no, it's a legit motivation, just statistically unsupported and likely to prevent FAR more real votes than fake ones. that hillary's people did it to bernie's people was dirty and underhanded, definitely full-contact party politics, and i don't support it at all. however, as JM said, intra-party selection processes do not include a constitutionally mandated right to vote, while general elections do. Sounds like semantics to me... "We the people" is also semantics, but the document it headlines is still kind-of important. JL

By: Michale

Michale — Sun, 22 May 2016 21:48:08 +0000

It COULD be construed as that..

Or it COULD be construed, as was the case in Nevada, to insure the integrity of the vote...

That's kinda my point...

If Democrats use Voter ID to insure the integrity of the vote, as Paula indicates...

Then is it SUCH a stretch to consider that Republicans have the SAME agenda???

Insuring the integrity of the vote??

Is that really so inconceivable??

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Sun, 22 May 2016 19:10:59 +0000

JM,

Sounds like semantics to me...

What it all boils down to is that Bernie delegates were denied their status SOLELY based on ID...

Now, you may say "that's different" and it very well may be different..

But from the viewpoint of Joe Sixpack, it's not different at all...

As Paula herself indicated... Voter ID is designed to preserve the integrity of the vote.....

ANY vote..

Given the current circumstances, it seems that we are ALL in agreement on that point..

Voting Integrity (whether caucus or whatever) is Priority Uno..

Republicans passing a voter ID law, for example, could be interpreted as a violation of this amendment, as a sort of end run around it, by requiring citizens to obtain documentation by PAYING for it FIRST, BEFORE being allowed to exercise their CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT TO VOTE.

It COULD be construed as that..

Or it COULD be construed, as was the case in Nevada, to insure the integrity of the vote...

Michale

By: John M

John M — Sun, 22 May 2016 18:57:10 +0000

Michale wrote:

"OK... OK..... And you feel it's perfectly acceptable that the delegates must provide ID to *PROVE* that they are registered as Dems..
Correct???
So, tell me.. How is that ANY different than voters having to PROVE that they are Americans and have the right to vote??
THAT is my point..
Clan Clinton invoked VOTER ID... And those that did NOT have ID couldn't vote.. And they were disenfranchised...
How is that ANY different than what ya'all accuse Republicans of..."

You are confusing two entirely different situations here Michale that are entire orders of magnitude apart from each other. They may seem like that have some kind of equivalency to you, but they in fact do not at all. Any similarity between the two is only superficial at best.

The Democratic Party, like the Republican Party, is a PRIVATE organization. Like a Fraternity, or a Private Club, or the Shriners, it gets to set up its own rules on membership and how it governs itself, including electing its own officers, of which its Party nominee is one. Unless there is a specific state or Federal law passed governing its regulation, the Democratic or Republican Party as a PRIVATE entity, is under no such obligation to follow any outside notions of what constitutes legal enfranchisement such as that provided by the U.S. Constitution. It only has to follow what is proscribed by its own bylaws. The U.S. Constitution only applies to the various levels of government, not to private Corporations for example. The Government cannot abridge your right to free speech, but the company you work for has every right to fire you if they don't like what you post on Facebook, for example, without violating your free speech rights.

On the other hand, what Republicans are doing, by passing voter ID laws and other measures making it harder for citizens to vote in elections for government institutions, is in direct violation of guaranteed Constitutional voting rights. That's the KEY difference. What Republicans are doing is different because it concerns government institutions, not private ones, governed by the rules of the Constitution itself. The Twenty-fourth Amendment of the United States Constitution, for example, prohibits both Congress and the states from conditioning the right to vote in federal elections on payment of a poll tax or other types of tax. Republicans passing a voter ID law, for example, could be interpreted as a violation of this amendment, as a sort of end run around it, by requiring citizens to obtain documentation by PAYING for it FIRST, BEFORE being allowed to exercise their CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT TO VOTE. That's only one such example of a problem with legislation like this. Do you see my point now?

By: Michale

Michale — Sun, 22 May 2016 16:05:31 +0000

And there are worries about Bernie and Democratic Party unity :)

Yes there are... And whatever is happening on the GOP side doesn't change that... :D

Michale

By: neilm

neilm — Sun, 22 May 2016 15:31:45 +0000

And there are worries about Bernie and Democratic Party unity :)

40 of the 41 delegates from Washington State are Cruz supporters. Even Trump's top guy in Washington State, state Sen. Don Benton, won't be going to Cleveland as a delegate. What a farce of an operation.

http://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/politics/washington-state-gop-convention-backs-cruz-over-trump/

By: Michale

Michale — Sun, 22 May 2016 15:00:42 +0000

http://presidential-candidates.insidegov.com/compare/35-40-70/Bernie-Sanders-vs-Hillary-Clinton-vs-Donald-Trump

I call BIAS...

Trump's an author as well...

Can't believe everything you read.. :D

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Sun, 22 May 2016 15:00:07 +0000

I call BIAS...

BERNIE
Professional Experience
Author
Documentary Filmmaker
Lecturer, Hamilton College, 1989-1990
Lecturer, Harvard University, 1989

CLINTON
Assistant Professor, University of Arkansas Law School, 1975
Attorney, Rose Law Firm, 1976-1992
Author
Former Board Member, Wal-Mart

TRUMP
Chairman, Trump Hotels and Casino Resorts, Incorporated
Founder/Chairman/President/Chief Executive Officer, The Trump Organization, 1975-present

Trump's an author as well...

Can't believe everything you read.. :D

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Sun, 22 May 2016 14:58:28 +0000

more wishful thinking on your part. current polls have it at 10-15%. 30% could potentially tip the general election. but a majority? extremely unlikely.

Time will tell...

Polls I have seen have Democrats approaching 40% in swinging Trumps way...

The more Clinton is slapped around by Trump, Bernie and the FBI...

Well that percentage can only get bigger...

Michale

By: nypoet22

nypoet22 — Sun, 22 May 2016 14:56:24 +0000

Ideologically speaking, a Bernie supporter has MUCH more in common with Trump than with Clinton..

now that's just flat untrue. here's a nice little graphic of clinton vs. sanders vs. trump on the issues:

http://presidential-candidates.insidegov.com/compare/35-40-70/Bernie-Sanders-vs-Hillary-Clinton-vs-Donald-Trump

The majority of Bernie supporters will likely go Trump before they would go Clinton...

more wishful thinking on your part. current polls have it at 10-15%. 30% could potentially tip the general election. but a majority? extremely unlikely.

By: Michale

Michale — Sun, 22 May 2016 14:19:14 +0000

Ideologically speaking, a Bernie supporter has MUCH more in common with Trump than with Clinton..

The majority of Bernie supporters will likely go Trump before they would go Clinton...

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Sun, 22 May 2016 14:13:39 +0000

not in nevada they weren't. that's a closed caucus system, not a primary. Yes.. And these Bernie delegates were part of the closed caucus system.. But their delegate-status was revoked because they didn't have the proper ID.. And, in doing so, Clinton's Cronies switched the WIN from Bernie to Clinton... Now you can invoke semantics and argue the definitions of 'delegate' and 'is' is... But that's just splitting hairs... Such dishonesty is routinely condemned when it happens on the GOP side of the equation.. Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Sun, 22 May 2016 14:11:02 +0000

-throwing is violence, whether it hits anyone or not. Death threats are violence. There is a bright line which has been crossed, to state the obvious.

Sanders’ supporters who felt disenfranchised responded aggressively. One man held a chair over his head menacingly. (Contrary to news reports, the man did not throw the chair; he placed it back on the floor.)

Can't believe anything the media says... :^/

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Sun, 22 May 2016 14:08:13 +0000

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2016/05/22/no_bern-ing_love_for_hillary_130630.html

Saying "DON'T PANIC" may be a bit premature....

Michale

By: nypoet22

nypoet22 — Sun, 22 May 2016 13:57:07 +0000

They WERE franchised to begin with..

not in nevada they weren't. that's a closed caucus system, not a primary. again, not what should be, just what is.

You can't have it one way for Democrats and another way for Republicans...

true, the republican caucus system is just as unfair as the democratic one.

however, it can be two different ways for a general election vote and a political party nomination. the former is legally mandated to be fair and open, the latter is a ridiculous patchwork of private and public pseudo-elections by parties that sometimes pretend to be in the public service.

By: Michale

Michale — Sun, 22 May 2016 13:42:03 +0000

that's not what i said - i wasn't discussing what should be, just what is. in order to disenfranchise someone, they have to have the franchise to begin with. They WERE franchised to begin with.. Bernie had won the Nevada Delegate vote.. But 60 Bernie delegates were disqualified because they did not have proper ID... I am just curious how ya'all can condemn Republicans for Voter Disenfranchisement but then turn around, shrug your shoulders and say, "Well, that's the rules" when Democrats do the EXACT same thing... Either the integrity of the vote is the overriding factor or it isn't.. You can't have it one way for Democrats and another way for Republicans... It's against the rules.. :D Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Sun, 22 May 2016 13:24:12 +0000

What's your opinion insofar as Bernie supporters being upset about being disenfranchised??

Do you feel they have a legitimate complaint??

Please note I am not asking you about HOW Bernie supporters expressed their anger.. We all agree it's inappropriate..

My question is, do you think they have a legitimate complaint..

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Sun, 22 May 2016 13:21:02 +0000

no, it's not fair, it's anti-democratic, and you're incorrect to insinuate that i support it.

My apologies...

What's your opinion insofar as Bernie supporters being upset about being disenfranchised??

Do you feel they have a legitimate complaint??

Michale

By: nypoet22

nypoet22 — Sun, 22 May 2016 13:08:27 +0000

"Would you clarify your position on abortion," a reporter asked?
"I have no position on abortion," said the second coming.
"But it was reported that you said..."
"That was incorrect. My agent will supply you with a transcript."
~ken siegmann

http://www2.cruzio.com/~zerocity/siegman.htm

By: nypoet22

nypoet22 — Sun, 22 May 2016 13:01:47 +0000

Well, according to JL, if the Democrat Party changed the rules to disenfranchise Hillary supporters because Bernie is the stronger candidate (which he is), it would be perfectly acceptable.. :D

that's not what i said - i wasn't discussing what should be, just what is. in order to disenfranchise someone, they have to have the franchise to begin with.

half the states don't have the franchise at all, they have caucuses. of those that do allow primary voting at the polls, many have primaries that are closed to anyone who isn't a member of the party. political parties are like private clubs, and have a first amendment argument against allowing non-members to join the process. whether they feel like checking voter id, party membership card or secret decoder ring is up to them, unless the state has specified otherwise.

no, it's not fair, it's anti-democratic, and you're incorrect to insinuate that i support it. however, it's the way US party politics has been since the election of john adams in 1796. nothing new under the sun.

http://www.digitalhistory.uh.edu/disp_textbook.cfm?smtID=2&psid=2976

By: Michale

Michale — Sun, 22 May 2016 12:39:54 +0000

Off topic..

http://www.thewrap.com/star-trek-fan-event-zachary-quinto-unveils-leonard-nimoy-way-at-paramount/

Celebrating 50 years of Trek....

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Sun, 22 May 2016 10:33:54 +0000

And the question before us is SHOULD the Democrat Party use VOTER ID as a pretext to disenfranchise Democrats who don't vote for the right candidate?? Giving the Democrat Party the benefit of the doubt, I'll re-phrase.. And the question before us is SHOULD the Democrat Party use VOTER ID to insure the integrity of the vote, even if that action has a secondary result of disenfranchising Democrats who vote for a certain candidate Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Sun, 22 May 2016 09:23:06 +0000

a presidential primary is not now and never was a public election. the delegates could vote tomorrow to change the party rules and nominate only homeless pastry chefs named ellen.

We're not talking about what a Party can or can't do..

We're talking about whether they SHOULD do it..

And the question before us is SHOULD the Democrat Party use VOTER ID as a pretext to disenfranchise Democrats who don't vote for the right candidate??

THAT's the question... Anything else is just a smokescreen..

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Sun, 22 May 2016 08:09:38 +0000

Are you saying that the Democrats as a party should disenfranchise voters who voted for HRC just because Bernie polls better? Well, according to JL, if the Democrat Party changed the rules to disenfranchise Hillary supporters because Bernie is the stronger candidate (which he is), it would be perfectly acceptable.. :D But, seriously.. :D I am just curious why everyone here supports Hillary when she is everything ya'all claim you are against??? She's beholden to corporate lobbyists. Bernie isn't.. She supports fraking... Bernie doesn't... She supports free trade agreements.. Bernie doesn't.. She has attacked MANY sexual assault victims. Bernie hasn't.. She has a MAJOR FBI criminal investigation hanging over her head like the Sword of Damocles... Bernie doesn't... You can see why I would be confused, eh?? And since when does anyone base their decision on who to support on how the person is polling or trending? OK, so we're in agreement.. Polls don't mean dick.. :D "OK, Ace. What ever you say. But lemme tell ya about those skills. As of right now, they mean precisely dick." -Agent K, MEN IN BLACK :D Michale

By: ListenWhenYouHear

ListenWhenYouHear — Sun, 22 May 2016 07:46:22 +0000

Hillary is LOSING in polls that match her with Trump..

Sanders is WINNING in polls that match him with Trump...

I'd love for Bernie to win the nomination, but it just does not seem possible at this point. And since when does anyone base their decision on who to support on how the person is polling or trending? Are you saying that the Democrats as a party should disenfranchise voters who voted for HRC just because Bernie polls better?

By: ListenWhenYouHear

ListenWhenYouHear — Sun, 22 May 2016 07:46:06 +0000

Hillary is LOSING in polls that match her with Trump..

Sanders is WINNING in polls that match him with Trump...

By: Michale

Michale — Sun, 22 May 2016 07:30:30 +0000

At a rally in Vado, N.M., {Sanders} offered a series of familiar attacks against Mrs. Clinton, criticizing her use of “super PACs,” her stances on trade agreements and her support of fracking. He also talked about the need to improve the poverty and high school graduation rates in the state.

Sanders is FOR everything ya'all claim to be for..

AND

And he is beating Trump in polls..

I honestly don't get how ANYONE here can support Hillary???

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Sun, 22 May 2016 07:25:32 +0000

Here's what I don't get...

Hillary is LOSING in polls that match her with Trump..

Sanders is WINNING in polls that match him with Trump...

Yet, ya'all are going with Hillary??

Does not compute...

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Sun, 22 May 2016 07:11:50 +0000

What is this, a game show? What did I win, a Pinto?
~mel brooks, high anxiety

I must confess.. Another classic I have never seen...

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Sun, 22 May 2016 07:10:09 +0000

a win? what kind of win?

The kind of win where we are all in agreement that the integrity of the vote is of a higher priority than an individual's right to vote...

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Sun, 22 May 2016 07:05:45 +0000

The rules were laid out well ahead of time. But glad you posted who it was that prevented those people from voting; which makes your comment that

And the rules on Voter ID are ALSO "laid out well ahead of time"...

Why is it you don't have a problem with VOTER ID and VOTER DISENFRANCHISEMENT when Democrats do it??

THAT's the question..

Why is it OK for Clan Hillary to disenfranchise Bernie voters..

to be

Assumes facts not in evidence..

There is PLENTY of facts in evidence that show Clan Hillary disenfranchised Bernie supporters..

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Sun, 22 May 2016 07:03:17 +0000

a win? what kind of win? i don't get it. a presidential primary is not now and never was a public election. the delegates could vote tomorrow to change the party rules and nominate only homeless pastry chefs named ellen.

OK, so if the Party decides to change the rules to disenfranchise ALL Bernie Supporters....

Yer telling me that ya'all would be perfectly OK with that???

On what planet?? :D

Michale

By: ListenWhenYouHear

ListenWhenYouHear — Sun, 22 May 2016 03:43:39 +0000

Michale said,

There is plenty of sources that prove Nevada State Dem Committee disenfranchised Bernie voters..

The rules were laid out well ahead of time. But glad you posted who it was that prevented those people from voting; which makes your comment that

Why is it OK for Clan Hillary to disenfranchise Bernie voters..

to be

Assumes facts not in evidence..

By: nypoet22

nypoet22 — Sun, 22 May 2016 02:47:20 +0000

What is this, a game show? What did I win, a Pinto?
~mel brooks, high anxiety

By: Michale

Michale — Sat, 21 May 2016 21:11:25 +0000

[40] Nope. False equivalency. If you mean the delegates had to be registered as Dems, yep. Thems the rules. {claaap}"Identical....." -Lane Smith, MY COUSIN VINNY :D It's rare that I get such a blatant and obvious win... :D I am going to have to enjoy this for a LEAST the rest of the weekend.. :D Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Sat, 21 May 2016 21:11:24 +0000

By: Michale

Michale — Sat, 21 May 2016 21:08:25 +0000

I tell ya, this DEMOCRAT PARTY-CIVIL WAR is *almost* (not quite but almost) as fun as CAPTAIN AMERICA-CIVIL WAR... :D

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Sat, 21 May 2016 21:07:35 +0000

Bernie's running low on funds too which further weakens him,

Yet Bernie is still out-fund-raising Hillary... And ALL Hillary has for funding is corporate Super PACs..

I bet ya'all are NOT thanking the gods (AND THE REPUBLICANS) for CITIZENS UNITED, eh?? :D

hehehehehehehe

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Sat, 21 May 2016 21:06:21 +0000

[39] You know dude, I could waste time providing sources and all that, but why should I? It won't make any impression on you and I don't need to convince you, I just needed to be satisfied myself about the basic facts. I am.

Yer absolutely right..

It DOESN'T matter if Hillary voters were disenfranchised or not..

ALL that matters is that everyone here has confirmed the legitimacy of the GOP's VOTER ID program by admitting that the priority is to insure the integrity of the vote by making sure ONLY legitimate voters vote...

So, we're good.... :D

Michale

By: Paula

Paula — Sat, 21 May 2016 21:05:25 +0000

[40] Nope. False equivalency.

By: Michale

Michale — Sat, 21 May 2016 21:04:20 +0000

BTW, Biden is now outpacing Bernie on PredictIt's Democratic nominee market.

https://www.predictit.org/Market/1232/Who-will-win-the-2016-Democratic-presidential-nomination

A "Candidate" who is not even a candidate..

You Democrats are funny..... :D

Michale

By: Paula

Paula — Sat, 21 May 2016 21:04:16 +0000

[37] neilm: yep. Bernie's running low on funds too which further weakens him, but also gives him motivation to keep running as he can keep fundraising. I have had no desire to see his campaign end on any kind of a sour note and it was only recently that I became convinced he can't pull it out. But the end is in sight and him looking like a sore loser makes me both sad and mad.

Oh well. We will soon see what he's made of.

By: Michale

Michale — Sat, 21 May 2016 21:00:57 +0000

Even IF Hillary voters were disenfranchised as well..

You seem to be indicating that IDing voters LEGITIMATELY takes precedence over disenfranchising voters..

In other words, it's more important to insure that the RIGHT/LEGAL people get to vote, even if that means that some legitimate voters are disenfranchised...

That's great...

I think we've taken a big step here in that everyone seems to be on the same page that VOTER ID is a legitimate tool to insure the integrity of the vote and that making sure the RIGHT/LEGAL people vote takes precedence, even if it means some legit voters don't have their votes counted.....

Come'on!! Group hug!!! :D

Michale

By: Michale

Michale — Sat, 21 May 2016 20:47:46 +0000

Hillary lost delegates who didn't comply just as Bernie did.

Assumes facts not in evidence..

There is plenty of sources that prove Nevada State Dem Committee disenfranchised Bernie voters..

There is NO substantiation that shows Hillary voters were disenfranchised...

Michale