"Know this well!! There can be no peace as long as Kirk lives!!"
-Klingon Ambassador

:D

Michale
283

I know you don't like links, but I am winding it up for the night..

I'll go into more detail in the morning..

Michale
280

Allow me to rephrase..

Due to the proximity of Cuba to the US and given it's "Gilligan's Island" feel it's natural to think that the people of Cuba have it all right...

But, in actuality, the people in Cuba are no more free than the people in North Korea...

They are simply oppressed in a nicer locale...

Michale
278

Touche'... OK, I deserved that...

{{SLAAAPP}}
"But I don't think I deserved that one.."
{{SLAAAPP}}
"OK, now THAT one I deserved..."
-Captain Jack Sparrow

:D

Business sees opportunities in Cuba, and business finances US politics. No advocacy of this situation on my part. Far from it.

While you make a good point that good business opportunities are opened up by opening up Cuba, I just think that one DOES need to address the oppressed masses...

Due to the proximity of Cuba to the US and given it's "Gilligan's Island" feel, the people in Cuba are no more free than the people in North Korea...

On to 300! :-)

Danke... Yer a mensch... :D

Michale
276

Glad I have that on record.. :D

I'm glad you're on record for putting words in my mouth.

Business sees opportunities in Cuba, and business finances US politics. No advocacy of this situation on my part. Far from it.

On to 300! :-)

At my last count there are 4... My research is not complete yet..

Michale
273

Cuba would have to extradite all the cop killers that are on the lam from the US and hiding in Cuba..

You mean, there's more than one?

So, yer saying we should ignore the humanitarian issues in favor of the business advantages.. :D

Glad I have that on record.. :D

Senior politicians of both parties see the embargo as counterproductive - it has helped the Castro brothers stay in power by providing a Boogie Man.

Oh bull donkeys... Fear is what has kept the Castro brothers in power.. Just like that statement that torturing terrorists proved to be a great recruiting tool..

If Castro didn't have the US as a boogie man, they would invent one..

It's already a BS caricature anyways...

Cuba is beginning to look past the Castro dynasty. Cuba has already looked past Russia. Cuba is not a child, but like children, countries mature.

And yet, there has been NO examples of maturity coming from Cuba, North Korea, Russia or Iran..

Yes, countries mature..

But, like children, they do not mature in a vacuum..

Reality may finally be sinking in. I don't think Obama will catch much Republican flak from this.

Yea?? That's what ya'all said about TrainWreckCare... Until the shit hit the fan and Obama caught a WHOLE LOTTA flak..

From EVERYONE... :D

Michale
268

Reality may finally be sinking in. I don't think Obama will catch much Republican flak from this. Noise will be made at upcoming Republican presidential debates and debating points will be mostly forgotten by Nov of 2016.

Having said that I acknowledge as accurate your anticipated response that sticks haven't worked much to date...

So, it's a quandary..

It could possibly work out wonderfully..

But, as we have seen what happens when Obama goes it alone, it's more likely to blow up and cause more problems than it was intended to fix..

Michale
267

I'll bow to your expertise in these matters vis a vis the school environment...

However, the process DOES work enough to make it a viable process.. Another example would be Military Basic Training..

The way to make a change is to get Johnny in private, away from the class, and show him that changes in his behavior will be rewarded, and the rewards will go away if he reverts to the old behavior. There's bound to be some push and pull, but ultimately the change happens.

In the case of North Korea and Cuba, back channels has shown little success...

There is little to no incentive to change if the US uses carrots only..

Michale
266

Pedagogically speaking, collective punishment doesn't work - instead of getting students to police their own, it galvanizes them against the instructor. Even the ones who would otherwise support you and resent Johnny for disrupting their learning environment end up resenting the punishment and joining in the disruption.

The way to make a change is to get Johnny in private, away from the class, and show him that changes in his behavior will be rewarded, and the rewards will go away if he reverts to the old behavior. There's bound to be some push and pull, but ultimately the change happens.

JL

We make him clean it up and punish him by taking everyone's TV privileges away...

Put another way..

As a teacher, I am sure you have had to punish the entire class due to the actions of one child..

"Little Johnny just won't stop talking so EVERYONE misses recess today!!"

Thereby encouraging the other children to "police their own" so to speak..

It's a tried and true disciplinary concept..

Michale

I'm not so sure that caring for basic human rights was the message our ongoing trade embargo sent to those living in Cuba. Many in the Cuban community in Miami may have seen it that way, but there's a division even there between hard-liners and those who want their relatives on the island to not be so cut off from the States.

Going with your naughty child analogy, I would ask what happens if he throws his cereal all over the floor. Do we teach him a lesson by making the whole family walk in a puddle of oatmeal, or do we still have to clean the floor, regardless of the "message" it sends?

JL

Misbehave, destroy the will of your people, keep your people enslaved and beaten and the United States will reward you...

Where is that famous (infamous??) Liberal compassion for the downtrodden and the oppressed??

I mean, what's more important??

The basic human rights of the Cuban people??

Or the Obama/Democrat Political Agenda??

Michale
258

The same reasoning applies...

If opening up relations with recalcitrant countries leads to better behavior, we should drop sanctions against Iran and Russia and the DPRK....

Obama's Cuba stance, unsurprisingly, sends exactly the wrong message to the world...

Misbehave, destroy the will of your people, keep your people enslaved and beaten and the United States will reward you...

Michale
257

-David

Fascinating...

Michale
256

Ya simply GOT to like that!!

Michale
255

How so??

As any parent can tell you, when you have a disobedient and recalcitrant child the very worst think you can do is reward bad behavior...

Much like Sony did with North Korea...

All this move will do is bailout the Castro regime and put them on an equal footing with civilized nations..

To put it in proper context, it would be as if the US would drop the Russia and Iran sanctions without either government changing their ways...

It rewards bad behavior..

Michale
254

-David

I'll concede that it's a distinction.. But it makes little difference...

To put it into it's proper context, it would be as if the GOP was only a little LESS restrictive in it's Voter ID agenda..

Sure, it's better than worse.. But it's still bad... It's still unacceptable...

But, as I said... I am less opposed to it if Cuba gives up all the cop killers and extradite each and every criminal to the US for trial, incarceration and/or (in some cases, if we're lucky) execution...

Michale
253

Interestingly, Rant Paul (R) is siding with Emperor Obama. He apparently thinks that Floridians have more important issues upon which they'll decide who to vote for and that he can also cede KY's GOP primary delegates. Or maybe he's just pretending that he's running for prez.

that's not entirely the case. this is not to say that the cuban population is well-treated. although definitely a dictatorship, cuba is not quite as totalitarian as north korea. i know i know, lighter shades of the same behavior. but cuba has dramatically eased restrictions on lifestyle choices such as religion - which is one reason the pope helped broker the current deal.

JL

Cuba would have to extradite all the cop killers that are on the lam from the US and hiding in Cuba..

No diplomatic relations until every cop-killer is given up....

Michale
250

Can we let that old tired dead horse rest in peace??

Every count before AND after the fact proved that Bush won Florida..

Basically the Left wanted to count and count and count until the Left got the result that THEY wanted...

Which NEVER was going to happen, as history shows...

All things considered, it's fortunate for this country that the "crazed sex poodle" didn't become POTUS...

Imagine Gore's reaction to 9/11..

"We filed a lawsuit in federal court to punish the terrorists who killed over 3000 innocent people"
-President Al Gore

:^/

Michale
249

The embargo will remain in place until Cuba's leaders enact certain freedoms for the Cuban people..

This is one law that Emperor Barack The First cannot memoranda away...

Cuba is a dictatorship, no different than North Korea insofar as how the citizens are treated..

Sony catering to North Korea... Obama cratering to Cuba...

What a topsy turvy world it has become..

Michale
248

Free people should be able to travel freely.

I get it now!!

Yer being held prisoner in a Chinese Fortune Cookie Factory, right!? :D

Michale
247

Nailed it, TS...

While it's true that the old Cold War may be fini, the Cold War lives on...

The players change, but the game remains the same..

Michale
246

Michale
245

... depending how you count Bush v Gore, where more Florida citizens legally eligible to vote tried to vote for the candidate who got more votes nationwide and would have gotten more electoral votes with Florida's, but where more votes were officially counted for the candidate who wound up being inaugurated.

End of an era to be sure, but the Cold War is frequently repurposed. Cuba is off the roster, N. Korea moves up the naughty list....and rightfully so. Russia's economy is in the toilet. Sanctions, and a bit of economic luck did that. Cold War Lite payback for Putin's fiddling in Ukraine. The game plods on.

Domain name I wish I had. Putinputyourshirtondickhead.

Those of us in the real free world, take note - if you have not yet traveled to Cuba, get to it before the inevitable American invasion!