But, Democrats can toss nukes around and you are perfectly OK with that..

Funny, iddn't it?? :D

Michale

Can you make ANY argument without lying? Democrats ARE the minority in the House. Republicans are the MAJORITY. Republican misconduct certainly hasn't been confined to the Senate, or to their time as the minority party.

I've no problem with anyone using the rules, its abusing the rules I've problems with. Such ad refusing to vote on confirmations because you don't want an agency to be able to enforce the law. THAT'S abusing the rules. If you don't have the votes to repeal a law you do nit have s tight to sabotage the executive branch exercising their duty to enforce the law by refusing to do your duty to consent.

Holding the debt ceiling hostage is ABUSING the rules.

Refusing to allow votes on any judges for the DC circuit to prevent a majority of Democratic appointees is abusing the rules.

Routinely passing legislation you know is unconstitutional in hopes that SCOTUS will illegally rewrite the constitution for you is abusing the rules.

And those frivolous lawsuits to delay Franken being seated required perjury, petitioning the court over claims that you know are invalid
That most definitely is lying, and its illegal. But its impossible to prove.

Bending theme rules may well be necessary on occasion. But the routine day in and day out, year in and year out, abuse of the rules is not a right, is not just "what the minority does." We don't routinely have the minority preventing government from functioning. Its never happened before.

You're the one that's always partisan. Always the Republican apologist. Always trying to defend Republican misconduct with specious claims that Democrats are the same--only worse!

Republicans simply have no ethics. And no one without ethics has any business in government.

I now await your inevitable unsubstantiated false equivalency that's somehow supposed to excuse Republican misbehavior.--Or at the very least change the subject.

But you have absolutely NO PROBLEM when Democrats do the same thing for the same reason...

Why is that??

Michale

Pure unadulterated bigotry..

Replace "Republicans" with "Mexicans" or "Hispanics" or any other nationality/race and you'll see what I mean..

But look at the bright side..

After these elections, Democrats WILL be the minority Party..

THEN we can see if the Democrat Party puts your "Minority Party's don't game the system" into practice... :D

Wanna lay any bets?? :D

Michale

Constantly trying to game the system by lying is NOT "what the minority does." Candidates do NOT file frivolous lawsuits for no other reason than to deny the winner of an election his rightful seat. Committing perjury simply to cause unlawful delay.

Abusing the filibuster to block ANY appointments is NOT "what the minority does." Refusing to allow votes on ANYTHING that THEIR party doesn't support is not "what the minority does."

The Republicans have become the antidemocratic party. Trying to enforce minority rule and PREVENT majority rule is NOT "what the minority does." Its what a corrupt dishonest unethical minority does. In spite of your constant lies to the contrary it IS NOT business as usual. The Republicans' success is due to their lack of ethics. They abuse the trust they've been granted and the power that they hold. They simply do NOT act in good faith and that is NOT "what the minority does."

They succeed because our system is based on voluntary cooperation and requires everyone acting in good faith. That's what everyone promised to do. Its why everyone must take oath TO promise to do.

But Republicans are liars. Their word, their oaths, mean NOTHING. That is NOT "what the minority does." That's just what corrupt modern REPUBLICANS do.

Duuuhhhh It's what the minority Party does...

Just like Democrats tried to prevent Republicans from doing anything when Republicans had control..

The fact that Republicans succeeded more often then not proves the incompetence of the Democrats...

Michale

It is so TYPICAL of you to claim Democrats had control and didn't do anything when Republicans did everything they could to PREVENT Democrats from having control OR doing anything. And ALSO ignoring the minor fact that in the brief time Democrats really DID have control they managed healthcare reform. Something that's been in the to do list for two decades.

You simply lie. Shamelessly. Unrepentantly. And then lie about lying!

Do you HONESTLY believe that, if Republicans had the House, the White House AND A SuperMajority in the Senate for two months they would not do a damn thing with it?

:D

Michale

Nothing got done when Democrats had the Super Majority...

Dems had a LITERAL lock on everything in the government..

And they couldn't do ANYTHING with it...

Not one damn thing...

Michale

OK, looked up that link for you. Scroll down to the MIDOTW section...

http://www.chrisweigant.com/2013/07/12/ftp264/

-CW

Fair enough. But you'll notice I did propose how to sell it to Republicans. If Republicans are fearful enough, they can be persuaded to still vote for things.

Sure, it may just be something to put into the "Obama tried to make this part of his legacy" box, but advising him to just shut up about everything would mean an awfully restrained next 2.5 years. I mean, what, he's not even supposed to TRY anymore? Again, you can call me naive, but to me, that seems awfully cynical and defeatest.

Here's another way of putting it: if Obama got behind Warren and they actually got a vote in the Senate (but then lost it), do you think that would help motivate younger voters this November? And could that change the demographic of enough states to hold the Senate? I mean, even when swinging for the fences, you can accept a bloop single as a good result, right?

[2] -

Yeah, I know. The article admits this, saying it wouldn't solve the whole problem. But it would certainly be a step in the right direction. As for radical changes, I have indeed come out for the Oregon experiment (or maybe Washington, I'd have to look it up in the FTP archives), of providing "pay it forward" college. THAT is the best idea I've heard ever, personally. Only applies to state schools and state residents, but still...

Michale [7] -

OK, I have to call a foul, here. You say that "nothing got done" like 2 comments after you noted that Obamacare got passed. It can't be both, sorry...

:-)

As for their supermajority, Dems only had it for two months, one of which Congress spent on vacation. Look up the dates of Al Franken being sworn in, and Teddy Kennedy's death to see the exact time period Dems held 60 seats.

LewDan [10] -

Aha! Something we can agree on (see prev. paragraph).

-CW

Sort of a preemptive strike to try to keep me from trashing YET ANOTHER patently absurd rightwing lie?--Nice try.

Obamacare...

'nuff said.... :D

And you're providing enough hysteria for all of us!

And what did they accomplish??

NOTHING...

Not ONE DAMN THING...

ZILCH... ZERO... NADA.....

So, why should the American people put Dems in charge when they can't DO SHIT even if they have a LOCK on everything??

Answer: They shouldn't..

Democrats are not fit to govern...

Waiting for the "yea, but Republicans blaa blaa blaa blaaa" and "IT'S ALL BUSH's FAULT!!!" Hysteria....

Michale

Dems had a supermajority for just TWO MONTHS! Republican challenges prevented Al Frankin from being seated for A YEAR! And Sen. Kennedy died in office.
As always, your talking points can't bear close examination because THEY ARE LIES! THAT'S why you've no proof of the millions of Obamacare policy cancellations you're POSITIVE that EVERYBODY KNOWS! about!--You wingers are "all hat and no cattle!"

Sorry.. That should have had a :D after it... :D

Michale

What got done??

NOTHING.. ZERO... ZILCH... NADA.....

So take your If-Only-Democrats-Were-In-Total-Control-Then-Things-Would-Be-Perfect mantra and stuff it..

We SEE what happens when Democrats govern..

US Prestige and Credibility hits the skids and American quality of life hits the gutter...

Since Obama and the Democrats have been in charge, not ONE SINGLE RELATIONSHIP with our allies has gotten better.

NOT ONE SINGLE ONE...

What does THAT tell you??

Michale

Dems HAD the House.. AND the Senate. AND the White House...

Guess what??

NOTHING got done.. It was a disaster of epic proportions..

Michale

Not a problem. When Dems win back the House again, legislation that actually helps Americans can pass again!

And yet, it passed and it's the law of the land..

Hardly "doomed to failure" as you stated...

Yea, I know.. It's a nitpick.. But I am in kind of a NitPik LD mood..

Dunno why.... :D

Michale

Exactly, Obamacare. When Obama threw his support behind it Republicans universally and rabidly turned against it, even though it was their own plan! For NO other reason than to spite Obama and spike his presidency.

If Obama actually backs a proposal the BEST thing he can do is maintain a low profile and AVOID becoming publicly associated with it.

Obamacare...

'nuff said.... :D

Michale

The cost of education is simply to high. One way business has been fattening profits for decades is by transferring the expense of training employees onto the employees themselves. Employees having to continue their education on their own time, at their own expense, saves employers a bundle. Profits THEY pocket. At employees expense. Yet ANOTHER reason for the widening wealth disparity.

And simply attending a trade school isn't an option.
Employers consider a college degree to be the minimum required just to insure literacy! We need to stop outsourcing everything as if there's no price penalty involved. If college degrees are now required just for general education then publicly financed education needs to extend through college.

This idea that business is entitled to things without having to pay for them is the problem. And its a direct result of workers having no power in negotiations. Of business being able to play people off against each other because they aren't allowed to effectively organize the way business does.

Higher education is something almost NO student can afford. Accepting the idea that kids are SUPPOSED to begin their adult lives by taking on massive debt so business can hire skilled workers instead of having to pay to train people is the problem.

Kids shouldn't have to mortgage their future to pay for a decent education because the one we supply them with is useless. No matter WHAT the interest rate is. And business should pay their own training costs. They sure as hell aren't compensating employees for it! That's WHY students are massively in debt for decades! Required to take on more debt for more education before they can even pay for their first "investment."

My one criticism is with your continued pretense of political naivety. Obama full getting behind ANY proposal will doom it to failure. You know that. Getting something through the Senate that's DOA in the House is pointless. And the House has only ONE goal to block ANYTHING Obama might claim as a success.

If Obama actually backs a proposal the BEST thing he can do is maintain a low profile and AVOID becoming publicly associated with it.

Why do you insist on pretending Obama can have a business as usual relationship with this Congress? Obama has no influence with them. Obama's interest can only prejudice them against it, as if more of THAT is needed!

If all we're going to do is stage political theatre, on BOTH sides of the isle no one need bother to do anything. I applaud Warren for actually trying to get some things done for the American people. Something few others seem much interested in, including you.

Are you interested in accomplishing the peoples business or posturing for voters? Because claiming Obama could really help an effort by getting solidly behind and pushing sounds like you've been in a coma for the last six years!