Yes, michty. Everyone in the world blames Republicans.. :D

It wasn't Republicans that wasted MORE resources shutting down 24/7 open air monuments.

It wasn't Republicans who kicked homeowners out of their OWN homes..

It wasn't Republicans that instructed Park Service Police to make things as painful as possible..

It was Obama and the Democrats.

No one wants to talk about that.. How come?? :D

Ya actually gotta feel sorry for Obama. His name is attached to the WORST website in Internet history...

Haha. True.

Now, come on!!! You can't......

Wait...

What you say!??

:D

Michale....

Want to talk about how the Democrats are fracturing???

Lol maybe you should re-read my post. You probably missed that because of your I-HATE-OBAMA goggles...

LITERALLY every single poll has shown the public blames Republicans for the shut-down. In big double digit numbers too. I haven't seen one that was good news for them, this Gallup poll was the worst one yet though. RCP poll shows that if the House election was held today you'd be looking at a Democrat House tomorrow (only barely though because the Republicans, embracing Democracy, have fucked the House up so bad Democrats have to win it by around 6 points to hold a majority. Bare in mind Democrats WON the House election last year by almost TWO points).

Ya actually gotta feel sorry for Obama. His name is attached to the WORST website in Internet history...

Haha. True.

For every "success" story ya'all come up with, I can find a dozen stories that show the rollout is a major train wreck...

Boehner put it best..

How the hell can Obama and the Democrats TAX people for not having health insurance when their portal to sign up is a train wreck..

Further, there are reports that these problems go so deep into the code, it's likely going to be many months before the site is working at all.. Possibly the entire sign up period..

As I said. Obama and the Democrats should be BEGGING for a years delay..

Michale

More than HALF A BILLION dollars for the obamacare website!!!

Are you frakin' KIDDING me!!!????

I tell ya, it should be Obama and the Democrats who should be BEGGING for a year delay!!

Ya actually gotta feel sorry for Obama. His name is attached to the WORST website in Internet history...

Obama will be remembered as the Internet Edsel...

Quite the legacy....

Michale

Cheers, mate

Hehehehehehehe..

Now THAT was funny... :D

Michale

http://washington.cbslocal.com/2013/10/09/college-grad-says-obamacare-has-raped-my-future-in-viral-letter/

An obamacare NOT success story...

Remember, one "aww crap" eliminates a thousand "atta boys"...

Michale

Why don't you want to talk about Obama's sinking numbers???

Want to talk about how the Democrats are fracturing???

{{{{chiirrrrrpppp}}}}} {{cchhiirrrrpppp}}

Didna think so... :D

Michale

"With the Republican-controlled House of Representatives engaged in a tense, government-shuttering budgetary standoff against a Democratic president and Senate, the Republican Party is now viewed favorably by 28% of Americans, down from 38% in September. This is the lowest favorable rating measured for either party since Gallup began asking this question in 1992.The Democratic Party also has a public image problem -- although not on the same elephantine scale as that of the Republican Party -- with 43% viewing the Democratic Party favorably, down four percentage points from last month."
(my emphasis added)

http://www.gallup.com/poll/165317/republican-party-favorability-sinks-record-low.aspx

This cartoon sums it up best: http://0.tqn.com/d/politicalhumor/1/0/B/1/4/Government-Lover.jpg

Also it's funny how Government ain't so 'evil', as Republicans have chirped on for DECADES, when you shut it down and people are pissed. But it's ok. There is always Plan B: Blame Obama! Lolol the whole notion that you've convinced by this is hilarious.

My bust..

Anyways...
More Dem civil war...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/dc-politics/dc-mayor-gray-confronts-reid-on-capitol-steps-over-shutdowns-impact-on-city/2013/10/09/02577428-3103-11e3-89ae-16e186e117d8_story.html

Anyone wanna talk about that??

No???

Because it's REALLY interesting..

“Democrats, at this critical moment, have abandoned their long-held principles. It's shameful to hold the city’s local funds hostage to make a federal point.”
-District Delegate Eleanor Holmes Norton

Ya see.. It IS the Democrats who are taking hostages...

Anyone wanna discuss it??

No???

Bummer... :(

Michale

Just when you think Obama and the (Help kids with cancer?? Why would we do that??) Democrats couldn't possibly go any lower down the sleaze poll, they do...

So, WHO is taking hostages???

WHO are the terrorists???

None of this was required by the shutdown.

It's Obama's Make It Hurt strategy...

And it is abysmal... It's disgusting..

And it's ALL on Obama....

Michale

Hahahaha amazing. Your logic is great. The websites didn't work, so the whole thing doesn't work. Can you imagine if they applied this logic to anything? "Sorry Mr Bank, your website keeps crashing so we're shutting down your bank" lololol

Back on the CR hostage situation. This. Is. Amazing.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=svb-CCdBrXY

Would you accept such a generic Rah Rah piece from Walker in Wisconsin???

Michale

No details, no verification. California said they had 5 million visits when the actual number was barely over half a million..

Plus you have a Democrat governor who has a stake in portraying the best possible spin..

Give me some facts...

Michale

Again, Bullshit... It's only 2 separate things because ya'all have a vested interest in it being 2 separate things...

Put another way.. If GTA V had rolled out with their online servers having a 99%+ failure rate, the blogosphere would explode with how crappy GTA V was... They would not differentiate between the game and the IT issue..

And neither would ya'all if you weren't politically invested in differentiating the two...

Michale

You mean, like CW.com??? :D

Michale

The state of Kentucky?

http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2013-10-08/what-kentuckys-obamacare-success-might-mean-in-2014

It's surprised a lot of people because I live next to Kentucky and it's not exactly liberal. They've avoided much of the issue by branding the exchange as Kentucky Kynect. If people don't think it has anything to do w/ Obama, they seem to be fine.

And yeah, IT seems to be an issue overall w/ the exchanges. But IT problems can be fixed.

To michty's point, why would you repeal the law because the IT was bad?

Wouldn't it make more sense to fix the IT?

-David

Bullshit...

You have listed at least one, though... That's more than anyone else has listed. :D

But it has no details about what he is paying, so it's incomplete at best...

But it IS a success story of someone who actually signed up..

Time will tell if he is actually legit, as there have been a couple Obamabot plants thrown out there as "success stories"...

We'll see...

But at least you agree with me that the rollout was a train wreck..

That's really all I wanted to hear...

Michale

Really? There are literally thousands out there. Probably not where you read. The more I read the more I can see why the GOP are trying so hard to stop Obama-care because people (especially Republican people) are quickly realizing the lies and bullshit they've been fed for years isn't true. Example: http://www.nationofchange.org/how-rand-paul-republican-alabama-learned-love-obamacare-1380982708

Don't get me wrong, I think the I.T problems and roll-out was abmissal. But to say 'the I.T System is abmissal' and 'the ACA is abmissal' are 2 completely separate things. The first is my opinion, the 2nd is not (and it's not something that can be decided in it's first 'real' week)...

But, look at the bright side..

Tonight I get to watch the season premiere of SUPERNATURAL...

So you'll have about an hour or so that will be Michale free.. :D

Michale

Does *ANYONE* have an obamacare signup success story???

David,

Everything I have posted regarding obamacare has been factual.

I'm sure some of it is.

It ALL is.. Verifiable 1000% factual..

Pick an incident..

ANY incident....

And I'll provide full and complete substantiation..

I also know, however, that the ACA is going to do a lot of good things like make insurance affordable for many people who it otherwise wouldn't be and end emergency care.

No.. You THINK this..

You cannot possibly *know* it because there is absolutely NO EVIDENCE to support such a claim..

You seem to ignore these things and focus on tiny flaws in order to get rid of something you've opposed from the beginning.

A <99% failure rate is HARDLY "tiny" by ANY stretch of the imagination...

But hell, you know me. I am the epitome of fairness..

Given me ONE SINGLE success story..

Just one verifiable success story.

Just one...

I kid you about Obamasteria but you don't seem to see the other side.

I do see the other side. And I have acknowledged it on several occasions...

But hay.. Let's do it again..

Once all the bugs and kinks and crap is worked out, it is entirely possible that obamacare MIGHT actually be good for the American people...

Your turn..

Do you agree that, based on all the available facts, at this point in time, obamacare is a major cluster-frak of epic proportions??

10,000 quatloos says you can't concede that.. :D

Don't worry about the hysteria comment.. I know I tend to go overboard.. But that's only because ya'all are trying to convince me that the sky is gree, water is bone dry and women have absolutely no secrets whatsoever..

But I know better... :D

Michale

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-politics-live/liveblog/live-updates-the-shutdown-4/?hpid=z2#c1e3ada3-dc00-41d8-92cb-327c5c814d82

Say it ain't so!!!!!

Once again, a steaming crock of total BS cooked up by Obama and the Democrats....

Michale

Isn't that Bush territory???

Michale

Lol once again totally missed the point. Not only HAVE the Democrats agreed to negotiation, they ALREADY NEGOTIATED and the Republicans got a pretty good deal - close to but not quite the Ryan Budget numbers for the CR. A very reasonable compromise, that I would say went waaaay too far (as usual) by the Democrats.

AFTER the negotiations were over, the Republicans then decided (at the suggestion of Ted Cruz) to add a COMPLETELY UNRELATED stipulation to the 'budget' negotiations. Literally, 100%, completely, absolutely nothing to do with the CR (hence why Obama-care is up and running even though discretionary spending is shut-down). I've pointed this out many times, but you're totally blind to this. Luckily most of the country (judging by polling data) isn't.

Since you completely fail to realize this basic fact - that negotiations ALREADY TOOK PLACE - because of your irrational, emotional, illogical and non-sensical 'blame Obama' attitude then discussing the CR and budget is pointless.

We can discuss the absolute disaster that was the roll-out of Obama-care. Because it seems discussing anything else with you is pointless since you'll ultimately only blame Obama. So we might as well keep discussion to things that there is actually >0% of responsibility falling on Obama's shoulders, like the horrific roll-out of his centre-piece legislation...

It's especially hilarious when one recalls how resoundingly I was criticized and ridiculed when I referred to "economic terrorism"... Which is a LOT closer to actual terrorism than the simple political disagreements we see in the here and now..

I don't think ya'all realize the kinds of precedents ya'all are setting...

All of them bad... Very bad...

Michale

I'm sure some of it is.

I also know, however, that the ACA is going to do a lot of good things like make insurance affordable for many people who it otherwise wouldn't be and end emergency care.

You seem to ignore these things and focus on tiny flaws in order to get rid of something you've opposed from the beginning.

Yeah, there's some things that could be fixed. I think everyone here would agree with you about that. First, and foremost, the rules that are incentivizing some businesses to hire more part-time workers.

Let's fix them then! Let's not throw out the baby with the bathwater

I kid you about Obamasteria but you don't seem to see the other side.

-David

What do YOU think about obamacare's privacy statement??

What do YOU think about credit rating being required to purchase health insurance??

Both of these are widely documented..

So, what do you think??

You think it's perfectly OK??

Michale

I am also constrained to point out that referring to another Party as "terrorists" solely because of political disagreements is a sure sign of hysteria...

What's REALLY funny is that, prior to this latest crisis, this was universally agreed on by (up to and including) CW himself...

Now, calling people terrorists just because of political disagreements seems to be not only common place, but EXPECTED...

How bad does THAT suck??

Michale

Dang you, Michale!

Ok, you know I'm kidding. Just thought I'd share because I thought you'd find funny.

Cheers, mate
-David

Everything I have posted regarding obamacare has been factual..

The fact that no one has any facts to refute any of what I have posted indicates that it is accepted as factual...

In other words, if I am wrong by all means. Prove it..

But if I am not wrong ya could at least acknowledge that.. :D

p.s. As for Miley Cyrus ... I'm with you, ick! :)

I know, right!?? :D

Michale

Symptions are:
- Excessive fear mongering
- Outrageous statements about Hitler, death panels, human sacrifices, etc
- The ability to ignore any facts which go against preconceived beliefs
- The belief that Obama is the anti-Christ
- A willingness to go to any extremes (even posing as a liberal) to stop the advance of the Devi ... err Obama

-David

p.s. As for Miley Cyrus ... I'm with you, ick! :)

And the more we find out, the more disgusting it becomes..

Did you know that, when you apply for obamacare, you have to provide documentation that proves your credit score??

And, if you have a low credit score, you are charged MORE for insurance??

And this is the law ya'all support???

*REALLY*???

I have to honestly say that, if I hadn't seen it with my own eyes, I would NEVER have believed ya'all would support this piece of garbage...

What's it going to take for ya'all to realize that obamacare is NOT a good thing??

Human sacrifices??

Forced euthanasia to harvest body parts??

Michale

Here is the Privacy Disclaimer for obamacare.

Should you decide to apply for health coverage through Maryland Health Connection, the information you supply in your application will be used to determine whether you are eligible for health and dental coverage offered through Maryland Health Connection and for insurance affordability programs. It also may be used to assist you in making a payment for the insurance plan you select, and for related automated reminders or other activities permitted by law. We will preserve the privacy of personal records and protect confidential or privileged information in full accordance with federal and State law. We will not sell your information to others. Any information that you provide to us in your application will be used only to carry out the functions of Maryland Health Connection. The only exception to this policy is that we may share information provided in your application with the appropriate authorities for law enforcement and audit activities.

This is the one for Maryland, but it's a standard disclaimer that is on all the websites..

So basically, ANY and ALL of your information can be shared with LEOs or the IRS..

And you people are SERIOUSLY on board with this??

So, I guess all the hysterical screaming about privacy and stuff during the Bush years was simply partisan motivated and ya'all really don't have any problems with your lives being open books.

As long as the Administration has a '-D' after their name....

On another, totally unrelated note...

If I see one more picture of Miley Cyrus's tongue, I think I am going to puke...

Is THAT what passes for "glamour" and "sexy" these days?? Hanging your tongue out to your knees like some cow??

Stop the world! I want to get off!!

Finally, let me ask one more time..

Does ANYONE know of an actual successful registration of obamacare where the person was happy with their new plan??

"Anyone? Anyone?? Beuhler??"

Michale

Obama and the Democrats are going all over saying how the debt limit ceiling is the coming apocalypse. That we're all going to die and our country will be destroyed..

Didn't they all say the same thing about sequester??

Once again, nothing but fear-mongering. The same thing ya'all castigate Republicans for, ya'all approve when Democrats do it...

Michale

Then I guess the Democrats are hostage takers. Because it is they who are holding the government hostage and their ransom is obamacare for their corporate stooges and cronies..

Again, I am gabberflasted that ya'all would side with the corporate cronies against the middle class.

Is Party loyalty REALLY that important??

It's amazing to me because I just can't see how anyone would totally decimate their principles based on Party ideology...

Michale

http://www.politico.com/story/2013/10/joe-biden-government-shutdown-debt-ceiling-97969.html?hp=t1_3

No??

Didn't think so..

David,

How about this for fair, if Democrats design and enact a government shutdown, you can call them "terrorists"?

Oh Democrats aren't terrorists..

They just SIDED with terrorists against Bush during the Bush administration..

Oh wait, I guess that DOES make them terrorists..

My bad..

Michale

When you disagree then you are someone who disagrees.

When you hold the government hostage because you disagree, you are a hostage taker.

-David

"The government shutdown has revealed the impressive skill of tea party Republicans to say untrue things with sincerity so convincing that they almost sound as if they believe what they are saying."

http://www.latimes.com/opinion/topoftheticket/la-na-tt-republicans-blame-obama-20131006,0,2739790.story

I am shocked!! Shocked I tell you..

No, I am not... not really... :^/

Michale

This is fact..

A one year delay MAY hurt the Democrats and their corporate cronies...

This is a possibility..

Ya'all have proven beyond any doubt that ya'all care more for the Democrats and their corporate cronies than you do for the American middle class..

I predicted this day would come.

A day when ya'all sacrificed your principles at the feet of The Great Exalted One, Emperor Barack The First..

ANOTHER one that I called dead on ballz accurate...

Michale

And obamacare just keeps getting better and better!!! :D

"That's a joke, son..."
-Foghorn Leghorn

Michale

While I'm glad for your concern for the middle class, Michale,

I am glad that you're glad...

My question is, where's your concern for the middle class??

Why are you supporting breaks for corporate cronies and not supporting breaks for middle class Americans...

That's what Republicans are fighting for...

Are you so fond and used to fighting Republicans that you will fight them on EVERYTHING???

ANYTHING???

You have always said that you will support whoever does the right thing..

Republicans are doing the right thing for the middle class...

Yet, you are STILL fighting them....

Michale

Where is the "balance" in calling people who simply disagree politically with you, "terrorists", "arsonists" and "criminals"??

You call that "balance"???

Fer real!!!????

Michale

The Republicans are shutting down the government and making the demands.

So.... Democrats are COMPLETELY blameless??

Well, there's really no sense in discussing it, if you are starting off in fantasy land and refusing to see reality. :D

I'll repeat what I said above..

If Democrats (and ya'all incidentally) refer to Republicans as "terrorists", "arsonists" and "criminals", do you really wonder why they won't negotiate??

Even then, it's Obama and the Democrats who have stated that there will be no negotiation..

Once again, Obama does EXACTLY what ya'all accuse Republicans of doing..

And yet, ya'all STILL support him??

So, once again.. All that is important is that '-D' after the persons name..

Everything else doesn't matter...

Michale

Well ... I guess if what you're interested in is power, conservatives have come up w/ a way to repeatedly move the country rightward.

The trouble I have is that I think we're best as a country when there's balance. We've moved so far to the right that Obama is where Reagan was on the political spectrum and he's being called a socialist.

-David

So Democrats actually totally gave in on the budget, compromising to slightly above the number Republicans wanted. Then Republicans said 'in a completely unrelated matter, we want you to also repeal Obama-care as part of this budget'. It's quite astonishingly laughable that they even attempted this. But then logic, sense and rationale hasn't been a large part of the (House) Republicans of recent...

Senate originally passed a CR of $1,058b then compromised down to $986b - in agreement with what Republicans wanted...

Wow. Boggles the mind. We are indeed living in an Orwellian world where nothing really much matters except 'loud'

-David

Brought to you by corporate lobbyists FreedomWorks (Dick Armey's former group) and Conservative Action Project (Grover Norquist, among others)

The thing being ignored by the Echo Chmaber (and most of the Corporate media) is that Democrats actually compromised on their first key point from this article you linked to and reduced spending in the CR to $974b.

But then Republicans said, ok now you've compromised on our first point we want ALL OR NOTHING or we're gonna go hostage on your ass!

It was the plan. February, 2013 ...

http://www.freedomworks.org/blog/ryanriebe/joint-letter-on-sequester-savings

Brought to you by corporate lobbyists FreedomWorks (Dick Armey's former group) and Conservative Action Project (Grover Norquist, among others)

-David

With regards to the shut-down, there is no real solution since the hostage taking side has forgotten what their ransom demands were. I can see this extending past the debt ceiling discussion.

With regards to the debt ceiling, I cannot see it going anywhere other than Obama having to take some sort of action himself (based on 14th amendment or what-not) to extend it.

Yes, Obama has 'ruled this out' but this is just him playing politics. He wants Congress to try and sort it out so that it becomes apparent to the big business donors just how lunatic, insane and moronic the party they support have become - willing to bring down the entire global economy if they don't get their way. Once he has shown this to them, he will step in.

Of course, I could be wrong and part of me doesn't think Republicans are stupid enough to play games with the world economy, especially given how unhappy their large financial backers will be at this. But then I didn't think Republicans were stupid enough to shut-down the Government because Obama wouldn't destroy Obama-care - so I guess if I can underestimate how stupid, insane and moronic they are once, I can do so twice...

Now THAT is funny!! :D

"It's funny because it's true",
-Homer Simpson

:D

Michale

And then you wonder why they aren't wanting to negotiate...

Seriously!!???

Michale

No, Democrats have shut down the government.

And Obama and the Democrats are doing their damndest to make it hurt..

What do you think about people being thrown out of their homes that they OWN??

What do you think about Obama actually spending money to enforce a shutdown on open air 24/7 monuments..

What do you think about Park Rangers who are saying that they were told to make it hurt as much as possible. "It's disgusting!" said one Ranger..

What do you think about that??

What would you think if it was a GOP administration doing all that??

I think we BOTH know the answers to those questions..

This 'ingenious plan' as I believe you called it, has been in the works for a long time.

Really??

Then why did ya'all say that the shutdown would never happen??

Why did ya'all say, when it DID happen, that it would only last a couple days??

Seems to me your statement now contradicts the statements made previously..

Personally, I don't think it was the plan. I think that, once the shutdown happened and Boehner saw how Obama and the Democrats ("Why would we want to help kids with cancer??") were overreaching, that solidified Republican ranks..

And, again you have to remember, that the GOP and the American people are on the same side as far as obamacare goes..

They are lined up against Obama, the Democrats and their corporate cronies...

Michale

The Republicans are shutting down the government and making the demands.

According to them, the only thing they will accept is giving them what they want.

If you're really opposed to the shutdown instead of just pro Democrat-bashing, talk to your Congressman.

-David

In my opinion, Republicans can be more organized initially and not push so hard for the extreme right up front..

Republicans can also try to look at things from the Left's point of view. Walk in their shoes, so to speak...

Finally, Republicans should allow for the fact that they CAN be wrong about things and change course if circumstances dictate such..

As an aside to Bashi, that's another thing that I disagreed with Bush about. His "stay the course" mentality. Republicans in general often get hampered by tunnel-vision and are unable (or, more accurately) unwilling to adapt to changing circumstances...

There is an old urban legend about a Soviet artillery commander that was executed on the spot because he wanted to move his artillery back a bit to obtain a better firing solution. The political officer took this as a sign of cowardice, that the commander was wanting to retreat. The commander was executed on the spot..

You see the lesson?? Sometimes, even often times, the best strategy is to take a step back. Get a different perspective of the "big picture"...

Republicans, in general, have a hard time doing that...

OK...

Your turn....

Michale

This 'ingenious plan' as I believe you called it, has been in the works for a long time.

-David

What can DEMOCRATS do to prevent things like this from happening again??

Michale

I completely agree..

It DIDN'T need to happen.

And it WOULDN'T have happened if Obama and the Democrats had just given the same break to the middle class that they gave to their corporate cronies...

It's really that simple...

Michale

Michale

Perhaps, CW. It's tremendously frustrating though because none of this needed to happen.

It's a completely contrived crisis. And ... it's quite likely we'll face more as Republicans ramp up for elections in 2014.

-David

Like I said above..

That's a start... :D

Michale

At least you concede the possibility that the Democrats could be wrong.

That's a start... :D

Michale

That was then. This is now..

Since Obama and the Democrats have employed a very childish Make-It-Hurt strategy, I predict that Democrats will bear the brunt of the dissatisfaction..

It goes without saying that, when it comes to obamacare, the American people and the Republicans are on the same page..

They've expressed guarded support for a "clean continuing resolution" bill which would end the shutdown immediately, without any Obamacare extortion. But their support has been downright timid, to date. None of them have been openly calling for John Boehner to hold such a vote. None have signed on to Democratic efforts to force such a vote.

There's a reason for that.

They don't exist. They are a fabrication of the Democrat's increasing fear that THEY will be blamed for the shutdown..

In fact, a procedural vote was held last week on a clean bill, but the Republicans held firm and even though Democrats fully supported it, it was defeated.

Loos like Boehner called out Obama and PROVED there wasn't enough support for a clean vote.. :D

The only question now -- which is an all-consuming question, as we enter Week 2 of the Republican shutdown --

Let's be clear.

Democrats hold the Senate and the White House.

The House sent a bill to the Senate that would have prevented the shutdown.

Democrats in the Senate defeated that bill.

Democrats can stop the shutdown immediately by agreeing to the same delay for middle class Americans that they gave their corporate cronies. A point that not one single Weigantian has addressed in over a week...

This is purely a Democrat shutdown, not a Republican one..

These are the facts...

But as the shutdown continues, you hear fewer demands for Obamacare changes, because Republicans have pretty much lost all public support for their position.

Assumes facts not in evidence. The American people are, more than ever, against obamacare. The fact that it has had less than 1% success rate probably has something to do with that. :D

Democrats promising to negotiate on anything under the sun is not really a concession at all, since they won't be agreeing to agree on anything with Republicans.

As I mentioned before, Democrat promises on negotiation are empty and simply not to be believed..

Obama and the Democrats have proven time and time again that they simply cannot be trusted.

In other words, their word means precisely dick..

"Let me tell you something about those skills. As of now, they mean precisely dick."
-Tommy Lee Jones, MEN IN BLACK

Is this the best answer? Probably not. But it could work, and so far, I haven't heard any better ideas. So it's at least worth trying. Because the alternative is to sit back and watch the Republican civil war take down the American economy as collateral damage in their power struggle. And that's not a very pleasant prospect.

Again,I re-iterate. (Probably because it's the strongest point around. :D)

The Democrats have the power to end the shutdown.

All they have to do is agree to the same break for the middle class that they gave their corporate cronies.

If this economy goes down the tubes because of the shutdown, Obama and the Democrats will be blamed.

It's really that simple...

Michale

<Because the alternative is to sit back and watch the Republican civil war take down the American economy as collateral damage in their power struggle. And that's not a very pleasant prospect.

If only the damage rendered by the Republican cult of economic failure could be limited to the exceptional and United States of America. (I don't really mean that but, GOOD GOD!!!)

Unfortunately, they'll drag much of the rest of the global economy down with them if they aren't stopped from wreaking the havoc they seem so determined to bring about.